WP shot for the E8

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Consti255
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Re: WP shot for the E8

Post by Consti255 »

MarKr wrote:
31 Mar 2021, 13:41
Yes, HE doesn't do anything against infantry in bunkers but that is intention because these tanks aren't there to counter bunkers. If your main concern is countering bunkers, then the next patch is bringing some changes to the bunker spam and also to the ways to counter bunkers. Then again, if your "flame shot" counters bunkers and infantry in them, the things that are already in the game to counter bunkers will be rendered useless by this new ability.

WP for Shermans is possible but IF it happens then it will be the WP as it is in the game now, no flames or other extra fluff.
Sad.
Nerf Mencius

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Walderschmidt
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Re: WP shot for the E8

Post by Walderschmidt »

RoyalCompanion wrote:
31 Mar 2021, 05:12
Why the hate on for having both? I don't see any issue keeping the cheaper 76 Sherman alongside the better E8. If you want to drop the upgrade to allow it then I don't really have any opinions on that but you have access to jeeps and 50 call jeeps why not allow both tanks?
Let me clarify. I want the E8 to be the price of the Sherman 76W. It's only slightly better than the Sherman 76. To quote Wake:
Wake wrote:
31 Mar 2021, 15:22
Since E8s vs 76 Shermans are being discussed in the other forum, I am curious if Warhawks and Wald believe the E8 is "worth" the additional price.

The E8 requires the HVSS Chassis unlock for 25 Fuel, and then each E8 also costs 7 more Fuel and 20 more MP compared to a regular Sherman 76(W). So in total, it is 32 fuel to be able to produce the first E8.

Is it better to contribute the marginal cost of the 32 fuel towards producing a second Sherman 76 rather than an E8? Would you rather have one E8, or two 76s?

This is considering that Warhawks said above that the ONLY benefits of the E8 over the regular Sherman 76 are:
  • 3% better armor
  • Faster movement (both in acceleration and top speed)
  • Slightly more accurate firing while moving
I don't think the E8s are worth the additonal price, which is why I'd get rid of the HVSS suspension unlock. I already have to get the supply yard before I can get a 76W. The HVSS unlock makes me have to spend an additional 60 fuel before I can unlock the 76W which is pretty much one more tank. This is part of why the Germans can outspam medium tanks to alllies and armor doc can almost catch up.

Wald
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AND SO IS DICKY

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Warhawks97
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Re: WP shot for the E8

Post by Warhawks97 »

Well, the e8 is a significant improvment over the normal sherman.
Warhawks97 wrote:
31 Mar 2021, 17:08
Wake wrote:
31 Mar 2021, 15:22
Since E8s vs 76 Shermans are being discussed in the other forum, I am curious if Warhawks and Wald believe the E8 is "worth" the additional price.

The E8 requires the HVSS Chassis unlock for 25 Fuel, and then each E8 also costs 7 more Fuel and 20 more MP compared to a regular Sherman 76(W). So in total, it is 32 fuel to be able to produce the first E8.

Is it better to contribute the marginal cost of the 32 fuel towards producing a second Sherman 76 rather than an E8? Would you rather have one E8, or two 76s?

This is considering that Warhawks said above that the ONLY benefits of the E8 over the regular Sherman 76 are:
  • 3% better armor
  • Faster movement (both in acceleration and top speed)
  • Slightly more accurate firing while moving


"only" can decide between life and death. Having for example a reload time of just 0.5-1 sec faster is already a big advantage.


In this case a sherman has an acceleration of 1.9 and s a speed of 4.1
Tiger has 2 and 3.8
Panther A/G has 2.5 and 4.4
Jagdpanther has 2 and 4.4

Now comes E8 with 2.2 acceleration and 4.6 speed. Essentially that means that you can out-accelerate any unit but Panther A/G and be basically faster than most other Tanks with exception of the Panther D (which has a much slower acceleration though).

It also has a higher rotation speed than the mentioned tanks and others.

I think "only" is a bit misleading here.

So, generally i am not having issues to first use the normal 76 to counter the initial spam and going for e8 in the late game when more agile panthers come out which can just toy arround with normal shermans.

Just after the HVSS unlock the e8 literally replaces the normal 76W but cost are so far unchanged.



Thing with the tank spam in general is not that shermans are wrong in terms of fuel cost. But when you talk about german mid armor spam we literally only talk about Panzer IV J, F2 and stugs which all cost just 40-45 fuel. The tec requirments are low (not counting CP into it) and upkeep very low as well.

The only thing you get at that time in terms of fuel requirments and fuel build cost is the M10. Otherwise you can just try to outmicro their tanks, spam zooks and medium AT guns.

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Walderschmidt
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Re: WP shot for the E8

Post by Walderschmidt »

Warhawks97 wrote:
22 Jan 2021, 19:22
E8 has slighlt better armor (76 has 0.85 received pen modifier, E8 has 0.82).

Its also a bit faster and loses somewhat less accuracy while moving.
You go from saying has slightly better armor, a bit faster, and loses somewhat less accuracy while moving to saying
Warhawks97 wrote:
22 Jan 2021, 19:22
"only" can decide between life and death. Having for example a reload time of just 0.5-1 sec faster is already a big advantage.
First you go from it's slightly better to it's a lot better. Then you say.
Warhawks97 wrote:
22 Jan 2021, 19:22
I think "only" is a bit misleading here.
I'm not even sure what you're trying to say. You say that "only" as in only a small improvement is misleading but then you can't even commit to that because you say "a bit misleading". Maybe it's a translation error.

On top of all this you make a thread about the E8, in line with the other too that seek to give it an ability to make it better and more distinct from the mere 76W Sherman.

In that thread you want to replace AP/HE with WP phosporous rounds that would be a combo of smoke/flame, give all Shermans a rapid fire ability, and then ON TOP OF THAT, want to replace the 76W with the Easy 8 that would cost the same as the 76W and reduce E8 received accuracy from .82 to .8.

So, you're taking my idea of just replacing the 76W with the E8 and getting rid of HVSS and adding extra buffs to the E8, which suggest to me that you do in fact think that the E8 is only slightly better than the normal 76W.

Which is it? MAKE UP YOUR DAMN MIND.

Wald
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AND SO IS DICKY

AND MARKR IS THE BIGGGEST ALLIED FANBOI OF THEM ALL

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Warhawks97
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Re: WP shot for the E8

Post by Warhawks97 »

Yes, the E 8 slighlty better than the 76 sherman. Its armor difference isnt really noticable. The chance for a Tank IV to pen is just about 2% higher as against e8.

The acceleration is a bit better. The speed is pretty much better. The 76 outruns any early german Tank or is at least on pair with it (F2) but with better combat stats. The e8 just helps to maintain this mobility advantage over the german Cats.


The e8 is way better on a tactical level when you got space to maneuver. But untill then they are basically the same in terms of combat performance.


I didnt say get rid of HVSS upgrade. That research stays. But then the standard is replaced by the E8. The cost would be the same basically.


I also didnt want to get rid of HE. But i questioned how usefull it is to give AP to shermans outside of armor doc. Because there is no target where this really matters for the outcome. Armor doc would be the only doc with all 3 ammo types and E8 basically.

Just i dont see a need for that burning shot for reasons markr pointed out. Stun smoke for shermans is what i requested.

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