Blitzkrieg Mod 4.9.0 Patch TEST

[Warhawks97]

Who exactly would buy BK doc grenadiers with 2xMP40? I don't really see any advantage in their weapon loadout variety.

dunno. But the only one that needs stgs is terror doc. BK has storms and def doc is actually def and arty orientated, however it has stgs and stupa which are clearly pure assault units or supposed to be so.


I think 2x;p 40 he means 2x 2 upgrades with each 2 mp40, each upgrade for 25 ammo (like grease for rifles). And hey, allied only have MPi´s for close range and they somehow need to deal with stens. Mostly grens are used for assault by def and terror doc and they not seldomly outmatch every allied elite inf simply due their stgs. In def doc with that def training the grens are often considered as the "new kch". So when BK would have MPi´s as upgrade they might become more a support for stormtroopers without providing the BK player something that is right away capable of dealing with allied commandos and AB´s. For def doc they would be focused more on defense with two lmgs.

[Krieger Blitzer]

Let's get to a more important point.. due to that the Armor doc is probably lacking arty support. I guess we have some various solutions or possible choices;
1-Just swapping the Jumbo with the Calliope while not changing any prices...
2-Swapping the Jumbo with the Calliope while decreasing its cost to 600MP, and increasing the Jumbo price to 950MP on the other hand!
3-Swapping the Jumbo with the Calliope while decreasing its price ONLY to 750MP having 2 available at a time, and increasing the Jumbo cost to 925MP as well.
4-No swapping, while to just decrease the Calliope cost to 600MP and increasing the Jumbo price to 950MP also!
5-No swapping again, while to decrease the Calliope price to 750MP having 2 available at a time and increasing the Jumbo price to 925MP too.

What do u think guys?

Personally I would say number 2!!

[Sukin-kot (SVT)]

3

Edit: I would also like the following solution: All stays like it is, but together with cali 105mm sherman will be available.

[Warhawks97]

3 as well.

Edit: I would also like the following solution: All stays like it is, but together with cali 105mm sherman will be available.

You mean calli and 105 unlock after 8 CP (so current unlock slot) and each limited to one1? Or swap with jumbo and calli+105 unlock with 5 CP´s being swapped with jumbo?

[Krieger Blitzer]

Well, I am fine with 3 too...
But I don't like the idea of moving or even just adding the Sherman105 to the Armor doc anyhow!

While I am ok about moving or just adding the arty Cromwell to the RAF doc on the other hand..


Generally I believe that Bunkers must get less HP!! Cause they are currently just insane to be honest; As well as the 107mm mortar emplacements for sure.


Are the handheld AT weapons going to have a decreased range btw??

[jonnyyankee]

When release?

[Krieger Blitzer]

We are not on a hurry.. I wouldn't even mind if it delays to September!

Take ur time devs, absolutely no one is running after u guys... We are seeking quality with this patch

[ShadowIchigo]

Who exactly would buy BK doc grenadiers with 2xMP40? I don't really see any advantage in their weapon loadout variety.

Yea i wouldnt see why anyone would do such a thing esp over stgs, but maybe they mean this as a balance type of thing sonce bk doc has sturmz

[Wolf]

Maybe, but grens in blitz aren't really a balance problem imo.

[Kasbah]

Bergetiger slower repair why? It's already a junk who barely can move, slow as hell, gets blocked in every corner and intersection, needs constant micro, be on a good position to repair, click many times and insist, and gets destroyed pretty easily

[Krieger Blitzer]

Well, honestly I wasn't recommending such a change! Specifically when to keep in mind that 2 US Armor doc specialized Engineers are actually repairing together with a rate of 20 (as that each is having a rate of 10 btw) while the BergeTiger was already just a single one with a rate of only 15... But it's probably fine somehow.. cause as u can see; those specialized engineers do now have an increased price also on the other hand!

[Warhawks97]

I would prefer having the Bergetiger with high repair rate but therefore only in TH doc and also only able to repair tanks, nothing else. Would be better than a general nerf on it. or?

[DaŇjeL_SK]

- All Churchills are harder to penetate by most weapons
- Churchill MKVI ("anti-tank" version) has now 6pounder
- Churchill AVRE petard shot range dropped to 75 (from 100)

Churchill even harder to penetrate ? ...because that tank was good enemy even against panthers if I good remember my games
Which way will change stats of churchill's gun penetration, when it will have mounted 6pdr ? ...better or worse ?
That must be joke with that AVRE.... it is biggest mortar in game (290mm I think)... once I get immobilized, after that german 120mm mortar was shooting me until I lost AVRE.. and I could do nothing, because he was on base and out of my range...
... now nerfing of range... less range than flak36...

... and I don't like that sniper changes

[Warhawks97]

- All Churchills are harder to penetate by most weapons
- Churchill MKVI ("anti-tank" version) has now 6pounder
- Churchill AVRE petard shot range dropped to 75 (from 100)

Churchill even harder to penetrate ? ...because that tank was good enemy even against panthers if I good remember my games
Which way will change stats of churchill's gun penetration, when it will have mounted 6pdr ? ...better or worse ?
That must be joke with that AVRE.... it is biggest mortar in game (290mm I think)... once I get immobilized, after that german 120mm mortar was shooting me until I lost AVRE.. and I could do nothing, because he was on base and out of my range...
... now nerfing of range... less range than flak36...

... and I don't like that sniper changes

Churchill thing is bit confusing and unclear which tank gets which weapon really. The MK VI and church ace should become the pure anti inf tanks with HE rounds and thick armor. That was original idea. The first with 6 pdr receiving AP rounds instead of HE. In this change they said they simply switch weapons but idk if it is final.... as i said, confusing.


About AVRE: i dont have a problem being a short range unit. In fact i would accept even a range of 50 but therefore thick armor also (like in reality, very short ranged bunker cracker). What bugs me that the AVRE needs to get into range of paks, 88 etc and even close to schreck range while Stupa and stuh keep untouched. By changing the AVRE that way the justification of stuh and stupa super range is gone which was called "its supposed to crack defenses, so it needs more range as defenses". Finally, i would finally prefer 60 range for stuh/stupa and scott and 50 range for AVRE. Stuh and AVRE cheaper then.

[DaŇjeL_SK]

- All Churchills are harder to penetate by most weapons
- Churchill MKVI ("anti-tank" version) has now 6pounder
- Churchill AVRE petard shot range dropped to 75 (from 100)

Churchill even harder to penetrate ? ...because that tank was good enemy even against panthers if I good remember my games
Which way will change stats of churchill's gun penetration, when it will have mounted 6pdr ? ...better or worse ?
That must be joke with that AVRE.... it is biggest mortar in game (290mm I think)... once I get immobilized, after that german 120mm mortar was shooting me until I lost AVRE.. and I could do nothing, because he was on base and out of my range...
... now nerfing of range... less range than flak36...

... and I don't like that sniper changes

Churchill thing is bit confusing and unclear which tank gets which weapon really. The MK VI and church ace should become the pure anti inf tanks with HE rounds and thick armor. That was original idea. The first with 6 pdr receiving AP rounds instead of HE. In this change they said they simply switch weapons but idk if it is final.... as i said, confusing.


About AVRE: i dont have a problem being a short range unit. In fact i would accept even a range of 50 but therefore thick armor also (like in reality, very short ranged bunker cracker). What bugs me that the AVRE needs to get into range of paks, 88 etc and even close to schreck range while Stupa and stuh keep untouched. By changing the AVRE that way the justification of stuh and stupa super range is gone which was called "its supposed to crack defenses, so it needs more range as defenses". Finally, i would finally prefer 60 range for stuh/stupa and scott and 50 range for AVRE. Stuh and AVRE cheaper then.

That original idea was stupid... 2CP for AT churchill.... every panzer4 will be fucked... so I hope mark isn't like u
And to that AVRE.... now I read it had range only about 100 meters... just normal british shitty war product... but when it will be nerfed to rifle range it will be pretty useless...

[Krieger Blitzer]

@Danjel;
AT Churchill has only a 6P gun man!

It should be first available than the anti infantry focused Churchill, as Hawks mentioned.. not sure for what reason MarKr swapped the guns...
Also generally Churchills should be costing some more fuel.


And hey guys; the 250mm Def doc arty barrage is somehow dealing less damage than the 150mm Nebels o.O

[Warhawks97]

The so called "AT churchill" is or would be the MK IV and using a 6 pdr, not 75 mm. The 6 pdr has pretty hard times vs Tank IV H/J´, even with special AP rounds. It comes currently with 0 CP but it could be changed. MK IV could be unlocked together with MK VI which would become anti inf churchill with 75 mm gun using HE rounds. Cost increase can be done also (fuel cost)


The AVRE would depend on armor, support and thus cost and abilties. With cheaper cost (allowing better support), buffed armor that can stand paks then it could fill its role still well even with rifle range: Cracking bunkers. Infantry support abilties for nearby inf would also increase the possible support and thus its valubility..

Just be a bit more creative, try to imagine thing, try to see things in a bigger context. Right you see: AVRE easy to kill and 0 armor.... ranged decreased= it will become usless. Think farther

[Krieger Blitzer]

- Lee einfield commandos can get Bren LMG after command tree upgrade instead of sten commandos
- Sten commando squad can buy Thrompsons

- 1897 AT gun price increased by 25 Munnition

Thx again! ^^


#Now; let me shortly remember u guys with probably all the remaining points that had been requested but being untouched yet...

1) Both the RA and the AB spotters should be able to capture points, as well as ONLY for the AB spotters to be able to crawl.

2) Swapping the Jumbo with the Calliope while decreasing its price ONLY to 750MP having 2 available at a time, and also increasing the Jumbo cost to 925MP.

3) After the poll of the 3rd Zooka removal hopefully ends, we would then really like to see the already agreed handheld AT weapon changes being finally on the list!

4) Generally I believe that all Bunkers must get less HP, and restricted only to the SE and Def docs too.. if possible!! Cause they are currently just insane to be honest; As well as the 107mm mortar emplacements for sure.

5) Maybe this one too:-

-US 75 HE howitzer gun of AB doc price cost would be:- 280MP, 20 ammo. (currently 400MP, 25 ammo) A big buff here for Allies because the Axis counterpart one is available without CPs and can shoot without barrage unlike the other. Yet, the Axis one costs only 350MP and 25 ammo currently!! SO logic here I believe. (Keep in mind that the Inf doc does also have one)

6) The bug of the invisible crew inside the Bren Carrier!

7) Walking Stukas to be moved to the 3rd building. Still requiring the final HQ upgrade but without any price changes...

8) The Junkers diving Stuka to replace the FW role, but the cost of this airstrike should then get cheaper from currently 215 to 200 ammo (like the RAF rocket Typhoon) due to that the Stuka is very much slow while causing a lot of noise leading to a possible easier avoid by the enemy.
Plz.. not the bugged FW-190 model in order anymore time again!!!

9) A similar arty barrage of the Def doc 88s to be added to the Luft doc 88s.

10) Only the Assault Storms and the Suppression Storms both should be no longer able to crawl without the veterancy training unlock. But surely still able to hide when in cover. Therefore.. the PanzerSchreck upgrade shouldn't prevent the crawling anymore I guess!

11) Cheaper Terror propaganda.

12) Cheaper Armor doc war machinery.

13) A strongly buffed Def doc 280mm arty barrage while remaining with the same current cost of 200 ammo, or a greatly reduced price instead!

14) The Bars suppression? The G43s stunning?? The Bren's ability??? Idk. The Gebirgs should have un-scoped versions of the G43 plz!

15) Undying US 37mm AT gun crew.

16) The PE Pz4 F to receive the same cost reduction of the Terror Pz4s made on 486.

17) HE sells to the CW Shermans. AT Churchill with a 6P gun should be first available... NO need for the gun swap which MarKr did! Also all of the Churchills should be costing slightly more fuel I believe.

18) Maybe the arty Cromwell could be moved from the CW arty doc to the RAF doc? Or at least to be just added so that both docs would have it??

19) Point number 31 of the "Inspiring of perfection!" topic

20) Cheaper vehicles?

21)
M1 Garand From;
US rifles: 0.65/0.45/0.2/0.2
Rangers: 0.75/0.55/0.2/0.2
To;
Rilfes:- 0.7/0.55/0.25/0.2
Rangers:- 0.75/0.6/0.3/0.25
___________________
And for the M1919:-
Damage from; 12-17
To; 16-20
Rate of fire from; 12
To; 8

22) More expensive bombing run Typhoons as it should be increased from 135 currently to 150 back once again, also the more expensive Long Tom as it should be increased from 250 currently to 265 and not 300 like before. Not to forget as well about the AB patrol price to be reduced from 265 currently to 250 and then that's it!

23) MarKr knows what I want to say here regarding the DF

24) 'Hold facing' ability to be added to all the turret-less tanks!

25) 200popcap mode similar to the 250 and 150 modes???
I seriously believe this would automatically balance many...

Hmm.. 25 points! Not that much btw.
But even if.. as I said before... There are still much to see honestly... So this is not surprising anyhow.
However that personally I would never object any delayed release time of the patch, even if until the next year; TAKE UR TIME GUYS!
Good luck.

[MarKr]

- All Churchills are harder to penetate by most weapons
- Churchill MKVI ("anti-tank" version) has now 6pounder
- Churchill AVRE petard shot range dropped to 75 (from 100)

Churchill even harder to penetrate ? ...because that tank was good enemy even against panthers if I good remember my games
Which way will change stats of churchill's gun penetration, when it will have mounted 6pdr ? ...better or worse ?
That must be joke with that AVRE.... it is biggest mortar in game (290mm I think)... once I get immobilized, after that german 120mm mortar was shooting me until I lost AVRE.. and I could do nothing, because he was on base and out of my range...
... now nerfing of range... less range than flak36...

... and I don't like that sniper changes

OK so the Churchills are available in this order:
1) MK IV with 6 pounder gun "AT variant" with timed AP ammo ability - available from the Tank Truck, no CP unlock. I would call it rather "anti-vehicle" Churchill since it has 6 pounder gun. 6pounder was literary the same gun as US 57mm gun (only Brits gave it its own name) so the weapon of this Churchill has pretty much the same stats as US 57mm AT gun. That means that it is effective against vehicles but struggles against medium tanks - so e.g. PIV H/J cannot be reliably penetrated from the front.

2) MK VI with QF 75mm gun "Anti-infantry" variant with HE mode - available from the Tank Truck after 1 CP unlock (and Command tank). QF 75mm was a gun similar to the one that M4 Shermans (75mm) were using. So this Churchill's gun has similar stats to those of M4 Sherman. That means that it can still take out vehicles, sometimes can go through medium tanks but veeeeeeery little chance against heavy tanks.

(then come the other Churchills in the same order as before)

Croc has the same QF 75mm gun so same performance there which also means that it won't be able to take out Panthers etc. anymore. There were more changes about Croc - it does not come with Vet level, it does not come with TC so it is actually no longer an "Ace" however it is MK VII with even stronger armor so it has a little bit stronger armor than other Churchills. Also the price was dropped.

So yes, Churchills will have even stronger armor than before but their weapon's strenght si very limited. In this situation they should be able to survive longer but to deal some damage to tanks you will have to support them with Achilles'/Fireflies. Churchills are still vulnerable from back, also Goliaths do more damage to them than before...so if you attack with only one Churchill, your opponent will outmaneuver it easily and you will lose it.

[JimQwilleran]

Tiger tank has 80 mm of side armor, 60 behind tracks. Churchill VII has 80~110 mm of armor. Is churchill going to have better side armor than Tiger now? If tiger bounces bazooka on his sides (bazooka - 100 mm of pen) then Churchill should bounce everything beside very close shots and shrecks.

For example axis 50mm gun should do nothing to churchill, 75 mm can't penetrate front, only sides and rear, but from close distance.

[Krieger Blitzer]

@MarKr;
Good job man! That's exactly what is supposed to be.. now looking forward to see the change-log being changed according to this but with also a modified price generally of Churchills as they should be costing slightly more fuel, I guess... Although in real life they weren't even cheaper than Tigers But anyways!

@Jim;
The Tiger's tank hull armor is like the following:-
100/80/80 (front\sides\rear)
And the turret's armor is just the same too.
So the Tiger's tank frontal armor is 100mm.. but btw 130mm with the additional metal plates at the lower front of the hull.
However that as he said already several times... Churchills now should be standing a lot much more hits for sure!!

[Warhawks97]

church MK IV had up to 101 mm and extra plates easily added (The purpose of the design was to easily increase armor). The MVI didnt really exist and had about same armor. The next main version was MK VII (1400 build till mid 44) and had 152 mm armor, sometimes up to 172 mm. Also 800 MK VII crocc had been build (most used allied flamethrower tank). So it would be cool to have instead MK IV, VI and VII crocc the versions MK IV, MK VII and MK VII crocc.

Tigers had frontally max 100 mm armor. But axis armor was harder (higher BHN) so an axis 100 mm armor could be compared with allied 110 mm armor. Disadvantage of harder steel was that it created more shrappnels when being penetrated or when cracking. Gonna check if they had 130 mm.



I have a question about PE inf build cost after 7th men upgrade. Why are the squads 1 MP cheaper when the 7th men is upgraded? As sample a normal Pgren squad cost 360 MP but after 7th men upgrade they cost 359 MP. Not an issue but i am just curious why it is that way.


Also what about the PE production upgrades int TH and support command? Luft has them but doesnt need it as Panther is unlocked even without. Also both cost 75 fuel but only one need to be upgraded.

I want to suggest to give Luft 75 fuel upgrade for Support command to unlock the Panther. TH and SE doc a 75 fuel upgrade in TH command only to unlock Jagdpanther and Jagdtiger and Nashorn.

[JimQwilleran]

I just say that Churchill VII should be more armored than tiger. The only thing that could penetrate that tank from front was 88/L71 and handhelds. Tiger tank could not penetrate more than 140 mm. That is why tiger should be helpless vs frontal armor of Churchill. Also tigers should have be less effective vs Jumbos.

[Krieger Blitzer]

Ya, he already said that the Croc VII is going to have even a stronger armor than the other Churchills btw... But the Tiger should be less effective against the Jumbo??? More than it is already?!

@Hawks;
The Tiger H had 100mm frontal armor.
The Tiger E had 100mm frontal armor but with additional 30mm frontal armor plates.

There is no Tiger H in Bk mod, only Tiger E... Both the early and late versions!
The Late version has a smaller commander hatch and an MG attached.. but no 30mm frontal armor plates on the other hand.
While the early version has a bigger commander hatch without any attached MGs and a 30mm frontal armor plates like the Ace Tiger!! But the Ace Tiger also has some extra fuel boxes at the back...

[Warhawks97]

I just say that Churchill VII should be more armored than tiger. The only thing that could penetrate that tank from front was 88/L71 and handhelds. Tiger tank could not penetrate more than 140 mm. That is why tiger should be helpless vs frontal armor of Churchill. Also tigers should have be less effective vs Jumbos.

i gonna check tiger vs Jumbo but i think not much is wrong here. The Panther gun (esspecially with APCR) is way too weak against Jumbo. (funny that Panthers never really had APCR rounds in reality:P)

The Jumbo could be penetrated by Panther guns and long 88 mm. Tiger would have issue vs 152-172 mm armor.