Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

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Tiger1996
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby Tiger1996 » 04 Nov 2017, 10:40

mofetagalactica wrote:Why they have minimal range?

I would say that's one of the most epic features of Bk Mod, because tanks in vanilla CoH could literally be ramming into each other while yet being able to still shoot at each other somehow... Which is indeed too silly and very arcade. So it's a very nice touch of realism in Bk I think!

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MarKr
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby MarKr » 04 Nov 2017, 11:21

mofetagalactica wrote:Why they have minimal range?
Because if they have no minimal range set, then they can shoot at targets that are between the tank's gun end and its chasiss which is weird.
EDIT:
Pretty much this:
Image
Tanks should be able to shoot with its cannon only at targets beyond the green dot. Without the minimum range settings, tanks would be able to hit with its cannon target standing at the red dot.
Image

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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby Tiger1996 » 04 Nov 2017, 16:40

Ok, so back to the "Tiger ACE vs Jumbo" thing... I have just finished testing this issue further with a mate of mine. We tested pretty much all tanks in the game! That took us too long to finish actually.. though I hope we haven't missed anything. We also tested Pershing ACE with some Axis tanks... For example, I asked my mate to drive his Panzer.IV close to my Pershing ACE, we also did the same with Churchills and Tiger ACE.

So far the result was that this bug was never observed at all, as it never occurred with any other vehicles.. so I suppose it only happens with the Jumbo Shermans when they are too close to Tiger ACE :) However, if I ever get to discover anything like that happening again... Then I would surely tell. Even if it is after the Steam release, that would be fine I think as long as it could be corrected quickly enough anyway.


As a side note though, I would really hope to see some nerf to HE rounds of AT guns and TDs on the next patch ^^ Only for TDs and AT guns that have HE rounds. Maybe more cool-down and higher price or anything else...

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mofetagalactica
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby mofetagalactica » 05 Nov 2017, 00:32

MarKr wrote:
mofetagalactica wrote:Why they have minimal range?
Because if they have no minimal range set, then they can shoot at targets that are between the tank's gun end and its chasiss which is weird.
EDIT:
Pretty much this:
Image
Tanks should be able to shoot with its cannon only at targets beyond the green dot. Without the minimum range settings, tanks would be able to hit with its cannon target standing at the red dot.


So you can set minimum range? I tought it was something game engine related, Why tanks with small barrels has the same minimun distance? Shouldn't those have less minimum range or none?

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mofetagalactica
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby mofetagalactica » 05 Nov 2017, 00:38

Tiger1996 wrote:
mofetagalactica wrote:Why they have minimal range?

I would say that's one of the most epic features of Bk Mod, because tanks in vanilla CoH could literally be ramming into each other while yet being able to still shoot at each other somehow... Which is indeed too silly and very arcade. So it's a very nice touch of realism in Bk I think!


Its understable for long barreled tanks, but not for those small ones with barrels that dosn't go further than the tank hull.

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MarKr
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby MarKr » 05 Nov 2017, 02:45

No, they shouldn't have shorter minimum range. You're argumenting with shorter barrel, so basically "realism". In that case a realistic counter-argument is that the tank guns still had some elevation restrictions and thus were still limited by some minimal engagement ranges. So setting the range to 0 is unrealistic because the tanks could not fire their main gun at soldiers that were knife-close. They would have easier time hitting a vehicle at the same range (due to its size) but we cannot set minimal range separately for different targets.
Then you will most likely say to set it to lower range than those bigger guns - we won't do that either because it is abuseable. You drive with the smaller unit to such range that you can shoot but the target cannot shoot back and then ven if it takes several shots, you don't need to care because the target cannot return fire...it has been abused before.
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby mofetagalactica » 05 Nov 2017, 07:19

MarKr wrote:No, they shouldn't have shorter minimum range. You're argumenting with shorter barrel, so basically "realism". In that case a realistic counter-argument is that the tank guns still had some elevation restrictions and thus were still limited by some minimal engagement ranges. So setting the range to 0 is unrealistic because the tanks could not fire their main gun at soldiers that were knife-close. They would have easier time hitting a vehicle at the same range (due to its size) but we cannot set minimal range separately for different targets.
Then you will most likely say to set it to lower range than those bigger guns - we won't do that either because it is abuseable. You drive with the smaller unit to such range that you can shoot but the target cannot shoot back and then ven if it takes several shots, you don't need to care because the target cannot return fire...it has been abused before.


¿Abused how? I don't see anithing bad with them having less minimal range. That's how a small tank with decent short cannon's is supposed to destroy tank hunters with long barrels and bigger tanks with long barrel, is a tactic.

If you keep thinking the same, then im going to use your "counter-argument" tell me what do you think as for example MG scour cars being able to shot at point blank distance? Even when the MG can't really aim that low to shoot at knife-close distance, thats being abused againts ATboys/paks/atsquads.

I will keep thinking that same min range for everyone is lazy as fuck.

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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby MarKr » 05 Nov 2017, 11:07

I gave you in my reply a reason based on "realism" (because that seemed to be your point) but also a gameplay reason for why it is set the way it is. Now you give me a reply that is a mix of reaslims and gameplay arguments. I said this before and will say it again - "realism" as an argument is never convincing for me if it is the main and only argument because realism is a double-edged sword but people always use it as single-edge. E.g. you say
mofetagalactica wrote:That's how a small tank with decent short cannon's is supposed to destroy tank hunters with long barrels and bigger tanks with long barrel, is a tactic.
Yes, realistically speaking that would work and the shorter barrel would give an advantage to the smaller tank. However in reality there would be ways to stop such tactic...e.g. a super heavy tank such as KT would be able to ram a light tank such as Stuart - in game that does not work because units cannot drive into/over one another. So you take the part of realism that suits your case but neglect the other aspects. That is why I will talk about game-play only from now on.

If you keep thinking the same, then im going to use your "counter-argument" tell me what do you think as for example MG scour cars being able to shot at point blank distance? Even when the MG can't really aim that low to shoot at knife-close distance, thats being abused againts ATboys/paks/atsquads.
This is still the mixed argument but gameplay-wise this is not really a problem because scout cars (and other bullets-shooting vehicles) are there to fight infantry and infantry (including AT teams) can shoot at point-blank too. In case of two tanks you can get into a situation where one can shoot at you and you cannot shoot (or do nothing in general) back.
Image

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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby Panzer-Lehr-Division » 05 Nov 2017, 14:15

mofetagalactica wrote:
MarKr wrote:
mofetagalactica wrote:Why they have minimal range?
Because if they have no minimal range set, then they can shoot at targets that are between the tank's gun end and its chasiss which is weird.
EDIT:
Pretty much this:
Image
Tanks should be able to shoot with its cannon only at targets beyond the green dot. Without the minimum range settings, tanks would be able to hit with its cannon target standing at the red dot.


So you can set minimum range? I tought it was something game engine related, Why tanks with small barrels has the same minimun distance? Shouldn't those have less minimum range or none?

It is already working in game with an trick. Even with big ass tank gun's likt jt kt etc i explained you in what's app
SunZiom: but true is you`re only one man which i know who really know how play PE
CyberdyneModel101: you're unstoppable

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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby mofetagalactica » 10 Nov 2017, 01:13

MarKr wrote:I gave you in my reply a reason based on "realism" (because that seemed to be your point) but also a gameplay reason for why it is set the way it is. Now you give me a reply that is a mix of reaslims and gameplay arguments. I said this before and will say it again - "realism" as an argument is never convincing for me if it is the main and only argument because realism is a double-edged sword but people always use it as single-edge. E.g. you say
mofetagalactica wrote:That's how a small tank with decent short cannon's is supposed to destroy tank hunters with long barrels and bigger tanks with long barrel, is a tactic.
Yes, realistically speaking that would work and the shorter barrel would give an advantage to the smaller tank. However in reality there would be ways to stop such tactic...e.g. a super heavy tank such as KT would be able to ram a light tank such as Stuart - in game that does not work because units cannot drive into/over one another. So you take the part of realism that suits your case but neglect the other aspects. That is why I will talk about game-play only from now on.

If you keep thinking the same, then im going to use your "counter-argument" tell me what do you think as for example MG scour cars being able to shot at point blank distance? Even when the MG can't really aim that low to shoot at knife-close distance, thats being abused againts ATboys/paks/atsquads.
This is still the mixed argument but gameplay-wise this is not really a problem because scout cars (and other bullets-shooting vehicles) are there to fight infantry and infantry (including AT teams) can shoot at point-blank too. In case of two tanks you can get into a situation where one can shoot at you and you cannot shoot (or do nothing in general) back.


Why are you supposing that im all what i said its because "realism" or "history" ? Im talking more about gameplay, It is fine for you that scout cars are being actually a counter for AT boys too? (gameplay) maybe you don't know how to make them abusable againts at boys since you're not a good player. It is also fine for you that small tanks with 37mm will never be able to do damage to bigger and slower tanks using more tactics than just "run around them" wich is never easy because rotation of the tanks and tank hunters are way to fast being something really hard to do and also adding that path finding of vehicles its pretty much broken somethimes, adding more tactics to small tanks to be able to do something is gameplay wise, while bigger tanks will still be able to easy 1 shot those small ones. Im talking all about gameplay.

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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby MarKr » 10 Nov 2017, 02:15

mofetagalactica wrote:Why are you supposing that im all what i said its because "realism" or "history" ?
Maybe because it sounds that way? Iike in this case:
mofetagalactica wrote:That's how a small tank with decent short cannon's is supposed to destroy tank hunters with long barrels and bigger tanks with long barrel
In the mod small 37mm AT guns are not meant to take out heavy tanks, period. So I thought when you said "supposed to destroy" you meant "historically" well, my bad then.

mofetagalactica wrote:It is fine for you that scout cars are being actually a counter for AT boys too?
How are scout cars and BOYS teams connected to minimal range of short barreled tanks? Anyway, scout cars are meant to be good vs infantry. "Good vs infantry" does not mean "good vs infantry but only that infantry that has no AT capability". It is not like BOYS squad should be untoucheable by vehicles.

mofetagalactica wrote: It is also fine for you that small tanks with 37mm will never be able to do damage to bigger and slower tanks using more tactics than just "run around them"
. Depends on what you mean. "37mm tanks" are currently only Stuarts and "bigger and slower tanks" is pretty much anything from the weakest versions of PIVs and up. Stuarts vs PIVs goes:
PIV D
Front: 62%; Rear: 100%

PIV E/F1/F2:
Front 20%; Rear: 57%

PIV H/J:
Front: 15%, Rear: 45%

These are values while shooting at maximum range, at close range the values go higher. So it is not true that "37mm tanks will never be able to do damage to bigger and slower tanks" - at least vs these medium tanks they can do damage. They can do damage even to heavy tanks but the chance is there very low and IT IS INTENDED. Light tanks are not meant to fight heavy tanks. If your opponent comes with tiger and your strongest AT is Stuart, you are simply fucked. These light tanks are not even meant to fight medium tanks. They can scratch them but are not meant to go against them. So yes, it is fine for me.

mofetagalactica wrote:adding more tactics to small tanks to be able to do something is gameplay wise, while bigger tanks will still be able to easy 1 shot those small ones.
You basically want light tanks to be able to take out targets that are waaaay out of their league. In its principle it is same as if you wanted US Engineers to be able to kill Fallshirmjagers at close range in 1v1 situations. Light tanks ARE able to do something. Current light tanks are Stuart, Chaffee, Tetrarch and Hotchkiss. Stuarts can be good vs infantry (they have canister shot + HE mode), Chaffee has phosporus shot which immobilizes enemy tank for a short duration and makes it unable to fire back (so this little fucker can immobilize even KTs or JTs and after that you can send air strikes or arty or stronger tanks/TDs to finish it off). Tetrarchs have two variants, one with howitzer (pretty much an "always-on-and-for-no-ammo-cost" HE mode) and the other can be upgraded with Littlejohn which makes it about as strong as 57mm guns - 57mm AT guns are not very strong vs front armor in the game but with the speed of tetrarchs you get a 57mm gun that can flank quite easily. Then the Hotchkiss remains. PE has way better armored units than this and therefore this light tank is mainly used for its arty ability so it is also not useless.
So as I said, all light tanks are able to do something.
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby mofetagalactica » 10 Nov 2017, 21:08

MarKr wrote:
mofetagalactica wrote:Why are you supposing that im all what i said its because "realism" or "history" ?
Maybe because it sounds that way? Iike in this case:
mofetagalactica wrote:That's how a small tank with decent short cannon's is supposed to destroy tank hunters with long barrels and bigger tanks with long barrel
In the mod small 37mm AT guns are not meant to take out heavy tanks, period. So I thought when you said "supposed to destroy" you meant "historically" well, my bad then.

mofetagalactica wrote:It is fine for you that scout cars are being actually a counter for AT boys too?
How are scout cars and BOYS teams connected to minimal range of short barreled tanks? Anyway, scout cars are meant to be good vs infantry. "Good vs infantry" does not mean "good vs infantry but only that infantry that has no AT capability". It is not like BOYS squad should be untoucheable by vehicles.

mofetagalactica wrote: It is also fine for you that small tanks with 37mm will never be able to do damage to bigger and slower tanks using more tactics than just "run around them"
. Depends on what you mean. "37mm tanks" are currently only Stuarts and "bigger and slower tanks" is pretty much anything from the weakest versions of PIVs and up. Stuarts vs PIVs goes:
PIV D
Front: 62%; Rear: 100%

PIV E/F1/F2:
Front 20%; Rear: 57%

PIV H/J:
Front: 15%, Rear: 45%

These are values while shooting at maximum range, at close range the values go higher. So it is not true that "37mm tanks will never be able to do damage to bigger and slower tanks" - at least vs these medium tanks they can do damage. They can do damage even to heavy tanks but the chance is there very low and IT IS INTENDED. Light tanks are not meant to fight heavy tanks. If your opponent comes with tiger and your strongest AT is Stuart, you are simply fucked. These light tanks are not even meant to fight medium tanks. They can scratch them but are not meant to go against them. So yes, it is fine for me.

mofetagalactica wrote:adding more tactics to small tanks to be able to do something is gameplay wise, while bigger tanks will still be able to easy 1 shot those small ones.
You basically want light tanks to be able to take out targets that are waaaay out of their league. In its principle it is same as if you wanted US Engineers to be able to kill Fallshirmjagers at close range in 1v1 situations. Light tanks ARE able to do something. Current light tanks are Stuart, Chaffee, Tetrarch and Hotchkiss. Stuarts can be good vs infantry (they have canister shot + HE mode), Chaffee has phosporus shot which immobilizes enemy tank for a short duration and makes it unable to fire back (so this little fucker can immobilize even KTs or JTs and after that you can send air strikes or arty or stronger tanks/TDs to finish it off). Tetrarchs have two variants, one with howitzer (pretty much an "always-on-and-for-no-ammo-cost" HE mode) and the other can be upgraded with Littlejohn which makes it about as strong as 57mm guns - 57mm AT guns are not very strong vs front armor in the game but with the speed of tetrarchs you get a 57mm gun that can flank quite easily. Then the Hotchkiss remains. PE has way better armored units than this and therefore this light tank is mainly used for its arty ability so it is also not useless.
So as I said, all light tanks are able to do something.


Fine you're right about some points.
¿Can you tell me the acceleration/speed of the chaffe and the stuart compared to the tetratch? (in-game)

Aryan222
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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby Aryan222 » 12 Nov 2017, 02:18

sup guys! so i downloaded the patch and run the game , but when i try to play the custom maps the game crashes , any ideas why this is happening ?

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Re: Blitzkrieg Mod 5.0.0 Patch

Postby Michael_Z_Freeman » 13 Nov 2017, 20:52

Aryan222 wrote:sup guys! so i downloaded the patch and run the game , but when i try to play the custom maps the game crashes , any ideas why this is happening ?


Not getting any crashes here. Sounds like a problem with you CoH installation.


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