What is missing? 4950!

[Krieger Blitzer]

I only need this ability on Tigers and Panthers, or just only earlier for Tigers; as I also never said Hawks idea is bad.. but simply it will never be implemented on Bk1 for several reasons... Talking from the viewpoint of Axis players as well as according to my experience.

JP is clearly a beast with Zimmerit upgraded specifically when it's ambushed as it does then act like paks by even having the same range! 2 of them are capable of frontally engaging a SP. While a single 1 ambushed is definitely a nightmare!!
Also talking from the viewpoint of Allies players as well as according to my own experience too.


Wolf is the only one at the end who has the final decision of separating between the 2 different opinions regarding this concern.

[Tor]

After last match i start think armor doc realy need 105mm sherman, spam at guns, mortars and nebels and i am lose, because cant kill AT guns.

[Krieger Blitzer]

Yes; I watched it, as I think u just need the Calliope earlier For 650MP.. exactly like as suggested on point number 2 already! ^^ U were obviously not in need for any Jumbos though...

[Tor]

Yes; I watched it, as I think u just need the Calliope earlier For 650MP.. exactly like as suggested on point number 2 already! ^^ U were obviously not in need for any Jumbos though...

Calli vs at guns? i think bad idea.

[Krieger Blitzer]

The AT guns were not that problematic already without the Calliope, but an earlier Calliope for such a cheap price too.. would definitely help much... At least!

Because adding Sherman 105 to Armor doc is a mad idea; this will provide more arty parties to the game as that the TH may also receive better arty on the other hand.

[Panzer-Lehr-Division]

Tiger, actually it should Keep the double Shooting ability... It is pretty good:) with ap combined. and if you have two vetted panthers, and can use this ability with ap! you can kill even sp it is more deadly then accurate Long shot in my opinion..

[Krieger Blitzer]

Hoho, really nice to see that Wolf has finally recovered the account for u by restoring ur password so that u could hopefully participate again after this long time! Welcome back to the Bk mod forums

Yes; Panthers should keep the Rapid Shots ability.. I withdraw point number 15... As it wasn't gonna happen anyways btw

[Butterkeks]

Well I prefer Warhawk's suggestion.

I only need this ability on Tigers and Panthers, or just only earlier for Tigers

Because you only use these two. So you simply want a "hotfix" for the tanks you use. You completely ignore every other axis tank. Warhawks' suggestions is a general fix for all tanks, balancing the whole tank fight, not only two.

And yes, Command car and command tanks need such a shitload of micro that I barely seem then, and IF I see them, then mostly only for SP. Which does not mean that SP or Command Car are anyhow OP.

[Krieger Blitzer]

I also use the JP, but yet I don't agree Hawks suggestion about it specifically since that still it will more likely never be implemented upon Bk1 in fact... And btw.. u almost never use Tigers so everyone would be surely seeking to improve only what he is usually adapted to! Don't u want to improve the Inf doc too? This is regular however that I believe this is not even the case with me; as I do like to play the Armor doc so much as well which is something that makes me fair enough with both sides I believe.

[Panzer-Lehr-Division]

the croc churchill btw is way too hard to kill whatever with tanks or inf and paks or even by flak 88s which is fine but the problem is that it comes too early and also very cheap to be so immune to almost everything toughly like this!

[Krieger Blitzer]

100% true, that's another reason why I really need the Accurate Long Shot earlier for Tigers... This fking Croc is impossible to approach almost with any kind of Axis weapons! If u get close to it with tanks seeking better penetration chances.. u will be immediately immobilized then; and if u ever manage to get close with inf units, u will be then instantly burned by the freaky flamethrowers it has!!
While it's too cheap and early available yet o.O Just ridiculous.

Usually I just keep running backward even with my Ace Tiger once whenever I face it ahead.. fearing not to get immobilized somehow only in a blink of an eye

[Butterkeks]

I don't agree with the Croc being to hard to destroy.

100% true, that's another reason why I really need the Accurate Long Shot earlier for Tigers...

And that would change anything because...?
Long shot only increases range, not pen chance. And even if, so you make one shot and then? croc drives abck and get's repaired.
These two things have nothing to do together at all.

[Krieger Blitzer]

I will at least not have to get too close to it every time not to get easily immobilized somehow, I will only try my luck from such a far distance.. or just try to snipe it at the rear armor then whenever this thing manages to turn itself around somewhere at anytime!

I mean that the Ace would at least become more reasonable to call in for now...

[Warhawks97]

How does accurate long shot helps here against armor of churchill.... *facepalm*. In fact the long shot would have also significant penetration drop since it should simulate a "3 km kill shot". But it uses the penetration values of the normal "distant range" which simulates 1400-1500 meters. So your long shot would never even penetrate Jumbos, churchillls VII or pershings! Ever thought about that?


Regarding the MK VII: Its a "Tank Tank" and supposed to stand most axis tank guns. To kill this tank axis do need the 88L/71 guns, panzerfaust and schrecks (Or panther guns). The MK VII is simply a "KT for allied" just with much weaker gun and just to soak fire and killing infantry. Its literally supposed to break through all axis defenses which includes the regular stationary 88 guns.

You can outflank it as well. I killed a corcc with just two PE AT squads. It did need 3 schrecks and one faust to kill it and i fired from two sides of which one was an ambush. It got blown up in less than 5 seconds from full HP and it cost me 0 men. Just blobbing is supposed to fail as well as endless camping.


Funnily the same discussion is running in coh2 forum as well with new CW faction. I never have much trouble killing the churchills, just many other axis "blobber noobs" are crying. I enjoy it in coh2. Sadly churchs get nerfed to shit there and epic schreck blobbs will kill all fun again. Anyway


What would be the point of churchill ace when not doing exactly this? Funny thing is, that all complained correctly that it was able to kill KT´s in 1 vs 1 and easily beating Tigers. Now they cant do shit against tanks with their gun and got buffed armor values (while it got penetrated before by tank IV guns and 75 mm paks even) to act a bit more realistic and suddenly its OP again. It also lost all ace levels.


So nerfing the armor would make this unit obsolet. It is just doing what it is supposed to do.

[Krieger Blitzer]

If it can't penetrate shit anyways from that distance.. then why are u so afraid of allowing it? Plus that I already mentioned that I will only try to make a good use of the ability at the right moment whenever the Croc manages to rotate or turn itself somewhere at anytime (which would be the player's fault after all) showing to me its rear armor!

Or do u think that even the Tiger Ace is supposed to advance while getting more and more closer to it in order to finally get immobilized instantly? Funny.

And who in hell asked to nerf the armor of it now???!!!

As well as that I am pretty sure btw that those of whom u r calling as 'crying Axis blobber noobs' would always give u such pain in the ass if u would ever dare to play against them whatever as Axis or even Allies... Just saying

[Warhawks97]

If it can't penetrate shit anyways from that distance.. then why are u so afraid of allowing it? Plus that I already mentioned that I will only try to make a good use of the ability at the right moment whenever the Croc manages to rotate or turn itself somewhere at anytime (which would be the player's fault after all) showing to me its rear armor!

Or do u think that even the Tiger Ace is supposed to advance while getting more and more closer to it in order to finally get immobilized instantly? Funny.

And who in hell asked to nerf the armor of it now???!!!

As well as that I am pretty sure btw that those of whom u r calling as 'crying Axis blobber noobs' would always give u such pain in the ass if u would ever dare to play against them whatever as Axis or even Allies... Just saying

i honestly dont get what you mean.

I said you can be glad that the Penetration values for long shot do not even drop below "distant penetration" values.


And Tiger ace or not. Its the same 88 afterall and a MK VII church is a very thick armored tank that can stand 88 tiger shells.


In coh 2 i do play a lot against this blobber noobs and i do this silly tactic by my own. It almost hurts my soul to see how effective such silly dump tactics are. In Bk luckly less now then once and as in coh 2. When i play coh2 as axis i am incredible lucky to see my mates schreck blobbs getting burned to hell by a single churchill while i am killing such tanks quite often with half the effort.

Sadly in coh2 they gonna nerf brits so that this silly easy blobb tactics remain effective even against brits.


So yeah, they are a pain. It really hurts how such "tactics" can work successfull in a game that is named "strategy game". In coh that silly blobb style with 0 brain is by far too overeffective and has nothing to do with tactic or strategy.

[Krieger Blitzer]

And Tiger ace or not. Its the same 88 afterall and a MK VII church is a very thick armored tank that can stand 88 tiger shells.

Ya, same 88s.. all should have the same range!

Yet we are speaking about a single fking shot for 50 ammo...

[Warhawks97]

And Tiger ace or not. Its the same 88 afterall and a MK VII church is a very thick armored tank that can stand 88 tiger shells.

Ya, same 88s.. all should have the same range!

uhhh... really so narrow minded? The 90 mm guns as well. 17 pdrs same as paks etc etc etc.


And again.... true sight, ambush options for all, hull down etc and the penetration drop etc etc. I´d like to see then how much "stronger" or better the tiger will get.

[Krieger Blitzer]

Pershings do already have this and without veterancy levels even... With the command car following behind, Fireflys (which is 17Ps) same.. by the CW command Cromwell and stationary position mode. Again without any veterancy or even any kind of ammo to be paid!
See who is truly narrow minded and retarded as well? Just pull urself altogether dude.

[Armacalic]

Pershings do already have this and without veterancy levels even... With the command car following behind, Fireflys (which is 17Ps) same.. by the CW command Cromwell and stationary position mode. Again without any veterancy or even any kind of ammo to be paid!
See who is truly narrow minded and retarded as well? Just pull urself altogether dude.

And the retard needs to be reminded that command vehicles are not free nor affect all vehicles at the same time and can be destroyed to take away the range buff.

"With what?" Hmm, let me think, is there no way to indirectly attack those vehicles or sneak a hard counter to take it down, or simply attack elsewhere? Is it really necessary for the axis to win all head on attacks for you to be happy?

[Krieger Blitzer]

Just take a side away from this subject plz.. u r not even a pvp player! Don't involve urself in what u r not meant with...

[Warhawks97]

Persh+ command car cost more.

The command vehicles and tanks can NOT be everywhere! You never seem to get it.
It cost ammo for the US
The command units can die easily and all important buffs migh be gone as well as 300 MP (and 70 fuel).



A firefly+ command tank is costly and kills only tanks. They have 0 durability or infantry killing power and no chance to bounce schrecks.



A i said, it seems you belive every allied tank pops out with a command unit in its arse giving all the time ultimate boosts. And a single shot with 90 range that can be used once vet is reached and that cost 50 ammo is more dangerous than a jackson that gets for 50 ammo 70 range in total for a short period of time and which manpower cost combined are 1050 MP while anti infantry power is again almost 0.



Longer time ago i faced scotts and SP with my storms and panther as well as lots of enemie inf. My mate has got an elephant starting to fight the SP.

my inf (despite scott fire when this unit was even more accurate as now) managed to make a schreck shot in all that chaos killing the command car. the SP did lose the range boost before making first shot and drove closer to elephant as he had order to attack this. The elephant could thus make the first shot (instead of the SP) and my Panther got also quickly into gun range that way. The SP then made one shot before three hits from panther, elephant and schreck killed it.

And that all happend so quickly and my decision to quickly snipe the command car that was just about to give a range boost instead shooting the SP directly turned this critical tank fight resulting in a quick death of SP which otherwise would have kept out of range as the Elephant player already made the mistake to go into stationary mode.

A Long range shot cant be prevented unless you snipe the Tigers gun which is a very unrealistic scenario.


Keep in mind that you also oneshoted SP with your tigers even with the ranged shot. Considering that Tiger would have never penetrated the SP from so far....

[Armacalic]

Just take a side away from this subject plz.. u r not even a pvp player! Don't involve urself in what u r not meant with...

Sorry, I can't take you seriously when your argument holds no water, and when I do play pvp once in a while now, find a better way to try and muddle your own credibility than by attacking others'.

By the way, what I said is still true, mate.

[Krieger Blitzer]

@Hawks;
U r misleading, the command vehicles are not even necessary for the Allies... U have stationary modes for those tanks of which are greatly enough of out-ranging the Axis tanks so easily.. while u could protect them with Scotts, Quad 50 HTs and dozens of emplacements too!

@Armacalic;
I don't give a fk about my own credibility.. u r even less than to be considered as rubbish. So just get lost out of my face now! U have nothing to do regarding balance over here even!! U never do nothing except is to just stalk on me everywhere... U r running behind or after every sentence I type anywhere located at any topic of the whole forums. Can't see any more comments of urs found on any other topics except those of which I am participating in!!!

[Armacalic]

@Hawks;
U r misleading, the command vehicles are not even necessary for the Allies... U have stationary modes for those tanks of which are greatly enough of out-ranging the Axis tanks so easily.. while u could protect them with Scotts, Quad 50 HTs and dozens of emplacements too!

Again, one cannot get rid of a defensive position like that with arty? No, your tanks won't win 100% of the time alone, deal with it.