BETA update 7 feedback

Talk about CoH1 or BKMOD1 in general.
kwok
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by kwok »

Snazz wrote:Which factions/doctrines are currently OP? :D


In my opinion (and ONLY in my opinion), propaganda doc is the most OP but requires some real skill to use. It’s a very high skill high reward doctrine and has only been buffed since release since players haven’t gotten use to playing the new style. But I’ve been pretty successful with it being able to beat players I usually cannot beat (for example redgarden if he doesn’t mind me exposing that fact).
Second would probably be inf doc because it was already strong before in 1v1s because of its power spike in the early to mid game, now it has better armor capabilities in the mid to late game to round it out. I’d recommend it for new players to try because it isn’t as nuanced as brits or PE, not as easy mode as WM that could give a false sense of reality, and not as punishing as armor doc.




Glad to have you back lionelus and devilroach! We are very open to hearing your feedback on the beta. There’s still a long way to go for balance but we will get there

Mood
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Mood »

Just wanted to drop by and say that the beta is pretty interesting so far. I've played on and off ever since Xalibur was still active and really disliked the direction the mod took after he left, which made me abandon it.

But the current team seems to do a lot better job. Looking forward to more stuff!

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MarKr
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by MarKr »

@Mood: Welcome to the forum and thanks for the positive feedback. It's nice to see people returning.
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Sparrow
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Sparrow »

@kwok @MarKr Hi, I will speak for some friends who doesnt like to write feedbacks, but at the end, they are players too...I will speak for Dick Winters, Egungun and others from the cubans who plays this wonderfull mod for CoH (friends of MEFISTO).

Why you cant use the pieces of artilery of your team? Its the same for axis, if you are defensive, and you build a howitzer and I kill them o they died, why I can not use them with my troops...? If you restrict this, them you should do the same for units from taking weapons form other armys, because they will not have the skills to understand those weapons from the floor.

We all know that you guys are trying to keep making better the pvp gameplay, but we also know that you respect the historical facts...and we have to remember that allies strike with force the german steel with their airborne, with their bombers, and arty. Im not an airborne player, I play with armor and infantry with allies, and know in BETA is all new...but my mates are not agree with those points that I exposed to you here. We are not asking to change ther habilities tree...

Cheers
Last edited by Sparrow on 16 Feb 2020, 02:13, edited 4 times in total.


panzeralcon
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by panzeralcon »

mira ese video sparrow; ta bien balanceado ahora los ataques aéreos, en general! para mi esta re bien esta actualización!

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Sparrow
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Sparrow »

And remember please...a veteran unit should not increse its HP...is the same unit...but should increase its accuracy against other unit of the same plane...not like a Panzer IV for infantry taking out a FireFly...or Panzerjaegres dancing in the flame of a Crocodile tank...HP is the same...the health of the soldier doesnt increase with a medal, is still a human...and a veteran squad inside a tank doesn make better the armor of that tank...but is more effective because of the experience.

kwok
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by kwok »

Sparrow wrote:Why you cant use the pieces of artilery of your team? Its the same for axis, if you are defensive, and you build a howitzer and I kill them o they died, why I can not use them with my troops...? If you restrict this, them you should do the same for units from taking weapons form other armys, because they will not have the skills to understand those weapons from the floor.
Cheers


From a gameplay standpoint, this was done because players were abusing the doctrines by building for teammates intentionally so that teammates will have access to artillery without teamwork/coordination. If we wanted armor doc or airborne doc to have howitzers we would've given them howitzers. Meanwhile other types of weapons (like mg's, AT guns, etc.) are comon unit types across factions/doctrines.
From a historical accuracy standpoint, this is not done for other units because most weapons WERE trained to be used across nations, including enemy weapons. However, artillery by nature required a lot of math, conversion tables, range finding, and a lot more sophisticated knowledge than most direct fire weapons.

We all know that you guys are trying to keep making better the pvp gameplay, but we also know that you respect the historical facts...and we have to remember that allies strike with force the german steel with their airborne, with their bombers, and arty. Im not an airborne player, I play with armor and infantry with allies, and know in BETA is all new...but my mates are not agree with those points that I exposed to you here. We are not asking to change ther habilities tree...


I dont understand what you mean. What points about airborne and historical accuracy? We have barely changed the ability tree for airborne.

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Sparrow
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Sparrow »

kwok wrote:
Sparrow wrote:
We all know that you guys are trying to keep making better the pvp gameplay, but we also know that you respect the historical facts...and we have to remember that allies strike with force the german steel with their airborne, with their bombers, and arty. Im not an airborne player, I play with armor and infantry with allies, and know in BETA is all new...but my mates are not agree with those points that I exposed to you here. We are not asking to change ther habilities tree...


I dont understand what you mean. What points about airborne and historical accuracy? We have barely changed the ability tree for airborne.


One of the determinating facts that achieve the allies in WW2, was that airbornes strikes with force against geermans units. The heavy tanks were easy targets for their allies air strikes and pieces of artillery. I cant tell you this fact is on BETA...it is not there...airborne maybe was barely changed, but the chances in axsis made them a bit weaker than they really were.

kwok the problem is that you havent been playing with us this days, maybe you were busy. We have played wit need ammo, panzer alcon, munchi an our mates, playing 4v4 or 3v3 most of time, and the results were more wining matches for axis than the allies. I feel that airborne is weeker than before. They had their sector agains a spam of tanks, but if you take out that, and replace it for an only one air strike, and the ATs shooting panthers without hit a single critical damage on them, when they have veterancy (veterancy should not give them more HP, and evasion is not the same than a repel shoot on its armor)...what should they do them?

Betas is not already finished...is a BETA, and we are testing it, so we could get a better balance y the future version. from what I have seen, this BETA is for AXIS. Armor is too slowy getting Pershings and airborne is useless in late game (if they are not going to have a sector, they should have an arty, a good one, ). Its just my opinion, and my friends opinion...

Right now one of them (Egungun) is dissapointed with the game dont want to play BETA anymore, he will keep playing the current version...but is just a matter of time BETA past to official and them everyone will have o play it or leave the game. That is not the choice you should give to us, the players...I am writing you to check this arguments...because from what I have seen this week, this is a returning to the oldest v4.7.8 version where the Axis were too much OP. If this keep like this, you would see pvp created matched with full axis team ready to smash an empty allies team.

Cheers

kwok
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by kwok »

Sparrow wrote:
kwok wrote:
Sparrow wrote:

I dont understand what you mean. What points about airborne and historical accuracy? We have barely changed the ability tree for airborne.


One of the determinating facts that achieve the allies in WW2, was that airbornes strikes with force against geermans units. The heavy tanks were easy targets for their allies air strikes and pieces of artillery. I cant tell you this fact is on BETA...it is not there...airborne maybe was barely changed, but the chances in axsis made them a bit weaker than they really were.

kwok the problem is that you havent been playing with us this days, maybe you were busy. We have played wit need ammo, panzer alcon, munchi an our mates, playing 4v4 or 3v3 most of time, and the results were more wining matches for axis than the allies. I feel that airborne is weeker than before. They had their sector agains a spam of tanks, but if you take out that, and replace it for an only one air strike, and the ATs shooting panthers without hit a single critical damage on them, when they have veterancy (veterancy should not give them more HP, and evasion is not the same than a repel shoot on its armor)...what should they do them?


Ah the airstrikes had a problem a while ago where it seemed like it always missed even when it looked like a direct hit. Can you send a replay? We will look into it.

From games that I've seen, the best counter against tank spam as Airborne has been m10s, bazooka/recoiless rifle spams, and paradropping 76mm AT guns that come with free AP shells. I'd save the rocket strikes only for large targets like King Tigers. Panthers are hard because they are so fast, I'd recommend at least trying to disable them first. A lot of the tanks come much later, including the panzer IV and panther. The only tank that still comes early in terms of CP is the tiger, but rushing the tiger right away against a good player is really hard because the propaganda doctrine is really weak without its early CP unlocks. I will hopefully get to play with you some time soon!

About the veterancy, I actually don't know if any unit gets an HP bonus with veterancy... Which units were you talking about?

Right now one of them (Egungun) is dissapointed with the game dont want to play BETA anymore, he will keep playing the current version...but is just a matter of time BETA past to official and them everyone will have o play it or leave the game. That is not the choice you should give to us, the players...I am writing you to check this arguments...because from what I have seen this week, this is a returning to the oldest v4.7.8 version where the Axis were too much OP. If this keep like this, you would see pvp created matched with full axis team ready to smash an empty allies team.

Sorry that he stopped playing the beta but the best way to make sure the beta doesn't go into the real game unbalanced is to keep playing the beta... So if he quit the beta then one day it will go into the real version and he will NEVER be able to go back. If he wants the beta to be better and things he likes to not go away, then he needs to post his argument and replays on the beta. This is the problem that players don't understand. If we don't update the game, people will leave the game by itself. We haven't updated the live version in almost a year and the game community shrinks because we haven't made updates. But, we can't make changes because people will be afraid of them and leave as well. So what can devs do? The best thing is for all players to try the beta and make sure it is okay first... This is not a choice we would give the players, but the players leave us no choice for about a year now. If you talk with Mefisto how long we have been working on this... for a YEAR and still are too afraid to push the change people players only complain but don't try to learn, practice, or give true suggestions (which is very different than complaining). No one will like ALL the changes in the beta, not even devs agree on most the changes in the beta. It's bad that you come to try it so late, but better late then never to help make necessary changes. I hope you understand the difficulty and that you'll work with us to making this be good. Explain to Egungun that if he just shuts his eyes and puts his head in the ground pretending the beta doesn't exist because he doesn't like it, then one day the beta will come to him and he loses BK forever. Explain to your friends if they don't like to post then we can NOT make any changes because we don't know what changes to make. Thank you so much for posting for them, THIS is very important information and things to talk about, when cowards are afraid to post then there is no progress.

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Warhawks97
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Warhawks97 »

Is AB doc supposed to keep like it is here? It hasnt got as much love and attention as luf got. Luft looks really cool and where you can choose a bit the direction with your inf what to get first and a cool and super usefull command squad.

AB is afterall very straight in many unlock segments. I think i already asked if it could get a reworked inf unlock where you can decide what to get first? Like you dont need 82nd and want vet or 101st AB, why is it still necessary to get the 82nd? When i look at commandos, Luft or BK doc or even terror you get some choices what to get first, which squad to unlock and so on. But AB is the only one that goes straight down the line.

And the leader squad is still not focused on its role which there is: Boost inf and use abilties... instead its still a close range/semi AT/Sniper/command squad for insane high cost and risk. Make it usefull like all other command units and focus it on the main role.

And the strafe still needs to buy AP ammo while axis gets a 20 mm right away....

And finally it would be nice to have some sort of 57 mm airdrop AT gun instead of always getting clumsy 76.


Put the same ammount of love in it like you did with Luft doc.

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Sparrow
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Sparrow »

kwok wrote:
Sparrow wrote:
kwok wrote:




Right now one of them (Egungun) is dissapointed with the game dont want to play BETA anymore, he will keep playing the current version...but is just a matter of time BETA past to official and them everyone will have o play it or leave the game. That is not the choice you should give to us, the players...I am writing you to check this arguments...because from what I have seen this week, this is a returning to the oldest v4.7.8 version where the Axis were too much OP. If this keep like this, you would see pvp created matched with full axis team ready to smash an empty allies team.

Sorry that he stopped playing the beta but the best way to make sure the beta doesn't go into the real game unbalanced is to keep playing the beta... So if he quit the beta then one day it will go into the real version and he will NEVER be able to go back. If he wants the beta to be better and things he likes to not go away, then he needs to post his argument and replays on the beta. This is the problem that players don't understand. If we don't update the game, people will leave the game by itself. We haven't updated the live version in almost a year and the game community shrinks because we haven't made updates. But, we can't make changes because people will be afraid of them and leave as well. So what can devs do? The best thing is for all players to try the beta and make sure it is okay first... This is not a choice we would give the players, but the players leave us no choice for about a year now. If you talk with Mefisto how long we have been working on this... for a YEAR and still are too afraid to push the change people players only complain but don't try to learn, practice, or give true suggestions (which is very different than complaining). No one will like ALL the changes in the beta, not even devs agree on most the changes in the beta. It's bad that you come to try it so late, but better late then never to help make necessary changes. I hope you understand the difficulty and that you'll work with us to making this be good. Explain to Egungun that if he just shuts his eyes and puts his head in the ground pretending the beta doesn't exist because he doesn't like it, then one day the beta will come to him and he loses BK forever. Explain to your friends if they don't like to post then we can NOT make any changes because we don't know what changes to make. Thank you so much for posting for them, THIS is very important information and things to talk about, when cowards are afraid to post then there is no progress.

Thanks you for your words kwok. Egungun is angry but still playing with us the beta, for now. We will start to save the gamplays looking for bugs, or something rare to report. For example, Egungun said that on his last match he call the SP of armor doctrine, and lost all MP and the tank never came into the game. Thats really hard, because in a difficult situation, loosing that ammount MP is critical for him and his team in general. I will keep posting here, and please check out the strike of the airborne doctrine. Also, the officer of Propaganda doctrine never get well at the hospital, he never cures his injuries...

Cheers

kwok
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by kwok »

Warhawks97 wrote:Is AB doc supposed to keep like it is here? It hasnt got as much love and attention as luf got. Luft looks really cool and where you can choose a bit the direction with your inf what to get first and a cool and super usefull command squad.

AB is afterall very straight in many unlock segments. I think i already asked if it could get a reworked inf unlock where you can decide what to get first? Like you dont need 82nd and want vet or 101st AB, why is it still necessary to get the 82nd? When i look at commandos, Luft or BK doc or even terror you get some choices what to get first, which squad to unlock and so on. But AB is the only one that goes straight down the line.

And the leader squad is still not focused on its role which there is: Boost inf and use abilties... instead its still a close range/semi AT/Sniper/command squad for insane high cost and risk. Make it usefull like all other command units and focus it on the main role.

And the strafe still needs to buy AP ammo while axis gets a 20 mm right away....

And finally it would be nice to have some sort of 57 mm airdrop AT gun instead of always getting clumsy 76.


Put the same ammount of love in it like you did with Luft doc.


Once again, the purpose of the reworks was to balance the game for 1v1's, not to give any doctrine any love. Personally, AB has always been my favorite so it pained me to see it essentially nerfed. But as an AB favorite player... describing AB as "straight down the line" is so far from the truth from my experience. To me, the doctrine has always been choose the right CP unlocks at the right time. Every unlock was focused on making sure I had the right capability against the right matchup. I had games where I never go down the paratrooper line until late game. In terms of choosing the specialization of AB inf, no other unit has a wider assortment of being able to choose garands, johnsons, bars, recoiless rifles, or bazookas. All of those at a discounted price after a very cheap wsc upgrade. I still get the 82nd for their HP bonus, suppression resistance, free bazookas, and most of all thompsons. I literally take down bases against decent players with just 82nd and smoke (except def doc because of their stupid super suppression building mgs). I have countless of those replays on this forum.

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mofetagalactica
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by mofetagalactica »

AB "changes" was a déception regarding infantry unlocks and support weapon unlocks. I can say nothing but to agree with all of what hawks said in his last post.

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Sparrow
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Sparrow »

@kwok We have been playing all these days and the conclusion we have arrived is that in this version Allies are more weak. Good players as mefisto, need ammo an others are playing with us and they have witnessed a lot of things we dont like:
-Luftwaffen taking points prepared with traps and without cassualties
-Trucks of Infantry doctrine that never appears in the late game (it happened to me, loosing -1500MP on that), just like SP bug
-Allies are weak with their armor support. You have to take most time ambush units to face off an axis tank. Heavy tanks of Armor doctrine like Pershing comes to late in the game, when you can see how geermans can depploy a Panther in the middle game.
-I have played with germans using defensive doctrine and I feel it too much OP, just like the Luftwaffen.
I dont know if the new habilities tree are looking for new mecanics in the game, changing the tactics we allways do (thats a fact), but what my friends and I believe is that this BETA has a lot of work to do and is not balanced yet, is far from that and I prefeer to keep playing old version instead of this one. I hope you guys realise that we are not the only one thinking like this. maybe we are not the best known by the community, but we have been playing this game since years in our Wireless LAN in our country, and thanks to LTE now we can play with the entire community.

As I see...you are runing into 3 development phases now:
-Finish the habilities tree of some doctrines
-Work on the detected bugs reported by the community
-Get a well balanced game in the future, by adjusting some OP units
You still have a lot of work to do, so head up.

Personally, I cant play this version only for playing OP axis...I like to play in both sides...at least allies were much stronger in the current version than BETA. Hope a better reworker comes in the future. Until that, we will stay playing the current but watching new releases of BETA

Greetings from Cuba

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MarKr
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by MarKr »

Sparrow wrote:-Luftwaffen taking points prepared with traps and without cassualties
I will check this. Can you provide more details? Which unit planted the traps? What Luft infantry takes no damage (Pioneers, Fallsh, Gebirgs?)? Does it happen every time or only sometimes - if only sometimes, have you found any rule when they take no damage (e.g. only with some unlock, only with Veterancy, only with command squad around)?
Sparrow wrote:-Trucks of Infantry doctrine that never appears in the late game (it happened to me, loosing -1500MP on that), just like SP bug
This is very weird. The Infantry and Armor doctrine were played quite a bit when they were reworked and they haven't been changed since then. Nobody complained about the call-ins not working and this is something that the players use a lot and I think they would notice - actually, there was a replay about two weeks ago where I saw Ranger Truck used without any problem. Again, is there some rule when this happens?

Sparrow wrote:but we have been playing this game since years in our Wireless LAN in our country
The Steam version does not have LAN support anymore if I am not mistaken...do you have the non-steam version? The non-steam is not supported by us anymore so if you are using the non-steam version and the bootleg BK version that rotates around the Internet some problems might be coming from there.
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Sparrow
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Sparrow »

MarKr wrote: I will check this. Can you provide more details? Which unit planted the traps? What Luft infantry takes no damage (Pioneers, Fallsh, Gebirgs?)? Does it happen every time or only sometimes - if only sometimes, have you found any rule when they take no damage (e.g. only with some unlock, only with Veterancy, only with command squad around)?

Fallsh. Was in a 4v4, Mortagis region original map. They were with veterancy. Anihilation and 225 pocap of rules in the match (we allways plays with these rules).
MarKr wrote: This is very weird. The Infantry and Armor doctrine were played quite a bit when they were reworked and they haven't been changed since then. Nobody complained about the call-ins not working and this is something that the players use a lot and I think they would notice - actually, there was a replay about two weeks ago where I saw Ranger Truck used without any problem. Again, is there some rule when this happens?

Well...it happens to me, I have the replays, so I will check that again. These two things occured in the same game (the fallsh and my trucks). If its correct what Im saying I will upload the replay to a cloud so you could download it and watch it by yourselfe, as the Airborne air strike killing no one with their heavy strike
Actually, it was 2 infantry Trucks bugged, and the traps explotes outside the range of the points, thats whay perhaps, how the fallsgaergers survive, but they are still OP.
download the replay from the attachment:
sparrows replay.rar
(547.48 KiB) Downloaded 3 times

and the videos from this source:
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/trq5wyd3ehcdi/
https://www.mediafire.com/folder/ww88ne2fj5gc2/
MarKr wrote: The Steam version does not have LAN support anymore if I am not mistaken...do you have the non-steam version? The non-steam is not supported by us anymore so if you are using the non-steam version and the bootleg BK version that rotates around the Internet some problems might be coming from there.

We are not playing the non-steam version. As a requisite to play in steam, we are using Steam version as everyone.
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CroW_TaTToo
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by CroW_TaTToo »

i have been playing the beta vercion for 2 weeks now and my conclucion is that is far from been finished im gratefull for the developers work but its far to broken to be realesed ass oficial and it dosent mather that the vercion its been in the test for a year or so by this time it should not have all thouse errors . i have been playin CoH more than 5 year now so i think i can say something about it
i play whit the english faction and they are broken AF truks dont go to were they supose to go wen build ability tree dont match to the armor truk in the RAF it say i have to activate the churchil in the tree but the tree is te same of the old vercion also i have to spent 14 ability point to fully upgrade the parachuters unit and by that time the LW trops are already fully upgrade since they only have to spent 8 point to be upgraded they are inmotals also the whit thouse 14 points i spect then to have some inpact on the field but no even a team of ingeniers whit machin guns make them they B. a light veicule taking out a farifly!!!! also the delay of the AT to move is realy nonsence wy the wait so the cars can flank them? they already miss a lot now the allied faction is realy unbalance they take quite some time to get a decent tank on the field and the germas have quit some arsenal of heavy tanks and since the sectos have been nerf how do you brake the tanks? have to whait 1 SP at the min 40 or 50 to do something? the perching comes to late in the game to do somenthing i have seen the new unit of the LW 3 guys kill like bugs an entire unit of comandos whit no loses also the cobat enginiers how an engenier can do more damage than an asault unit?? this new vercion is a SAPAM vercion you win whit spam of units it makes the oter unis useless as they cost more and do less this games its supouse to be a real simulator or at least the closest aaaalso now you cant get the artillery pieces from a friend wy??? and dont tell me they dont have training its ok to make the artillery take ammo per minute but if this is implemented already there is no need to disable the unit if its broken because if i have the ammo and my team mate dont i can get the artillery piece and let it consume my ammo . like this more stuff but hey english is not my language and my head already hurts sorry for the miss spellings.
in conclucion the game is more unbalance than the old vercion the old vercion works fine it just need some tuning but not that rough change. the beta now like it is it takes away the fun of the doctrines as you can do anything whit anithing specially if you are axis at least make them balance they are not specially the LW 2 mobile AA shoting at 1 squad and the still kill the AAs it takes away the desire of playing the game i have switched now to the old vercion again me and other 8 mates
ps also wy propaganda doctrine¿¿¿ the doctrine its TERROR that include the propaganda game on it you do not batle whit paper propaganda is a way of inflict terror and descorage on the units but nor to call a doctrine like that terror wass the real name of that kind of warfare
thanks to all

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MarKr
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by MarKr »

Hi, you mention a lot of things. I'll try to react to some of them.
CroW_TaTToo wrote:i play whit the english faction and they are broken AF truks dont go to were they supose to go wen build
This is because you set a "rally point" for your HQ. All units built in this building travel to that point and trucks are tecnically "built" in the HQ. In the next update we want to introduce a change that might help with this a bit.

CroW_TaTToo wrote:ability tree dont match to the armor truk in the RAF it say i have to activate the churchil in the tree but the tree is te same of the old vercion
This is a mistake, RAF is not intended to have Churchills. It will be fixed.

CroW_TaTToo wrote:also i have to spent 14 ability point to fully upgrade the parachuters unit and by that time the LW trops are already fully upgrade since they only have to spent 8 point to be upgraded they are inmotals also the whit thouse 14 points i spect then to have some inpact on the field but no
"LW" are Luftwaffe Fallshirmjägers, right? The Commandos have bigger variety of skills and unlocks, some even unlock weapons for free or defensive and offensive passive bonuses that Fallshirms don't have. It is just different infantry and also meant to be used a bit differently.

CroW_TaTToo wrote:also the delay of the AT to move is realy nonsence wy the wait so the cars can flank them? they already miss a lot
It is there to prevent a bug that players abused to make the guns shoot a lot faster than they should. If I am not mistaken the accuracy was improved a little bit.

CroW_TaTToo wrote:now the allied faction is realy unbalance they take quite some time to get a decent tank on the field and the germas have quit some arsenal of heavy tanks and since the sectos have been nerf how do you brake the tanks? have to whait 1 SP at the min 40 or 50 to do something? the perching comes to late in the game to do somenthing
Axis have some Tigers and Panthers able to unlock quite soon but if you unlock them as soon as possible and try to build them as asoon as possible, Allies have a good chance to destroy them because Axis will be skipping important unlocks that help them survive. Kwok can explain this better in detail.

CroW_TaTToo wrote:i have seen the new unit of the LW 3 guys kill like bugs an entire unit of comandos whit no loses
Interesting...and then we have people who complain how weak and useless the Fallshirms are. Anyway, it depends on what unlocks each squad has, what weapons, where they are fighting etc.

CroW_TaTToo wrote:aaaalso now you cant get the artillery pieces from a friend wy??? and dont tell me they dont have training its ok to make the artillery take ammo per minute but if this is implemented already there is no need to disable the unit if its broken because if i have the ammo and my team mate dont i can get the artillery piece and let it consume my ammo
Howitzers are doctrine-specific units, same as Pershings or Kingtigers. You also cannot build a Pershing, "kill" the crew and let your team-mates take it. One of the reasons why the howitzers were strong was that people just gave them to team-mates and the enemy had to fight against 6 or more howitzers (each team-mate had 2 or 3). If you have ammo and want to shoot arty, every doctrine has some arty unit. Not as strong as howitzers but they have arty. Use what your doctrine offers.

CroW_TaTToo wrote:ps also wy propaganda doctrine¿¿¿ the doctrine its TERROR that include the propaganda game on it you do not batle whit paper propaganda is a way of inflict terror and descorage on the units but nor to call a doctrine like that terror wass the real name of that kind of warfare
It's not Terror anymore, it is Propaganda now. This doctrine gives you a chance to try some other play style than just "Axis = strong but expensive". It also gives you option to play more with abilities and less with raw strength.

I understand that English isn't your mother language but could you try to use some interpunction (full stops (.), commas (,) ) and paragraphs? It is a lot harder to understand the text if there is no (.) and so you need to decipher where one sentence stops and another starts. ;)
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Sparrow
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Sparrow »

@MarKr have you checked the replay and the videos?
From what I see you are really shure about the damage values or health of BETA units. For you there is a well balance. Time will tell who was right about that. The reason why all of you or me, might be wrong, is because there are only a few feedbacks of this BETA.

I propose to you to launch the currentBETA code to everyone, in the same launcher of Blitzkrieg, because there are a lot of people who play this game and never enter here or the facebook group. If you put the BETA available to everyone and some how you let them know a link to download the BETA from the Blitzkrieg launcher, I am completly shure that you will have more BETA testers and of course, more feedbacks to checks. In almost 15 days only 8-10 users playing BETA. There are not good information facilities to the users, or they simple dont like the BETA at all or not interested.

Cheers

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MarKr
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by MarKr »

@sparrow: I've been busy at work last few days so I haven't seen the replays yet but I would like to get to it today or tomorrow.

However, there is a topic in the announcement section about the public beta which gives a manual about how to activate beta for anybody who wants to try it. BK Discord chanel is more active than our Facebook page and everybody on the Discord knows that there is beta, the most active people there know how to access it so if anone asks, they will tell them how to get it working. I also think that when the beta turned into a public beta there was a message about it at the FB group too.

Anyway, I am not sure that everything is well balanced, actually, we know that some stuff is not completely balanced right now. However, we get feedback from players that say that some doctrines are broken and/or weak and at the same time we have feedback from players that say the same docrines are fine or even OP - and some of these players even send us or post here replays where they show how they have no problem winning with these doctrines. So we have different feedback and we need to read everyone's point of view and somehow try to figure out where the truth is. We cannot just say "sparrow says this so we'll believe him and ignore everyone who says something different".
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needammo
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by needammo »

Hello good day, Can we see a way to bring back the patrols?
For example, from a certain number of AAs that planes stop appearing

there's some insues but they are not the big deal

-Americans
-The rangersHMG are not affected by the captain's aura the same for crewed weapons
-The companions of the rangerHMG do not automatically shoot at enemies when they are camouflaged only when they lose camouflage
-

British
-The British light mortars are not affected by the lieutenant's aura, but when he recrew the mortar affects them
-The British captain does not earn veterancy when the units within his area kill units (I do not know if this is intended)
-The game crash when I throw a grenade from the Kangaroo (having units inside)

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MarKr
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by MarKr »

Sparrow wrote:and the videos from this source:
OK, I've watched it.
The trap thing is not something unique to Fallshirms. The ability works the way that when a squad starts capturing a point that is booby-trapped, it "creates" an explosion at the position of a random soldier from the squad within few seconds (there is a "min" and "max" delay). You can see that the squad was spread quite wide, one soldier started capturing the point and the game just randomly created the explosion at the position of the soldier who was pretty far from the point and by the time it exploded the soldiers had already moved far enough from the explosion to avoid it. This can happen with any squad, not just Fallshirms and it is a bit about luck too.

As for the airstrike - it was again bad luck. You can see that two rockets hit the Jagdpanther and both triggered some critical hit. One destroyed the main gun, and I don't know what did the other but it is clear that there was another "red text" above the vehicle. This is can happen with almost any gun - get two criticals in a row and the vehicle is alive with very little HP.

needammo wrote:Can we see a way to bring back the patrols?
Sorry, but this will most likely not happen. Patrols were "no skill" abilities where you just clicked somewhere and watched everything in that area get vaporized.

needammo wrote:-The rangersHMG are not affected by the captain's aura the same for crewed weapons
-The British light mortars are not affected by the lieutenant's aura, but when he recrew the mortar affects them
This applies for all factions and commander units. It is because of how the game engine works with these "team" weapons. We cannot fix this.

needammo wrote:-The companions of the rangerHMG do not automatically shoot at enemies when they are camouflaged only when they lose camouflage
Isn't there the "hold fire" button for this? I am not sure, maybe it is intentional so that the squad does not give away its position?

needammo wrote:-The British captain does not earn veterancy when the units within his area kill units (I do not know if this is intended)
I think the Captain gains veterancy but only from units in certain range and also in the same sector he is in. But I've definately seen Captains with higher veterancy so they gain some vet from units around.

needammo wrote:-The game crash when I throw a grenade from the Kangaroo (having units inside)
This is the first time I hear this. Does it happen every time? If so, I am afraid the only solution will be to disable throwing grenades from within the vehicle.
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Gurkenkilla
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Joined: 16 Aug 2015, 15:01

Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by Gurkenkilla »

Is there any rework for Scorched Earth planed? I'm feeling this doctrine being major useless in comparison to the other PE doctrines.

kwok
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Re: BETA update 7 feedback

Post by kwok »

Oh my goodness, so many posts. I haven't had time to respond but MarKr are said most the things I think are worth saying. I will only add a few more things and respond to something that MarKr asked me to talk about more.

MarKr wrote:
CroW_TaTToo wrote:now the allied faction is realy unbalance they take quite some time to get a decent tank on the field and the germas have quit some arsenal of heavy tanks and since the sectos have been nerf how do you brake the tanks? have to whait 1 SP at the min 40 or 50 to do something? the perching comes to late in the game to do somenthing
Axis have some Tigers and Panthers able to unlock quite soon but if you unlock them as soon as possible and try to build them as asoon as possible, Allies have a good chance to destroy them because Axis will be skipping important unlocks that help them survive. Kwok can explain this better in detail.


We did this because after watching many many replays we noticed a common strategy/build order in EVERY game with certain doctrines. In the live version: The Tiger was RARELY rushed by good players and failed to be rushed effectively by bad players because of it's high cost going into T4 with upgrades and fuel cost. The panther was ALMOST ALWAYS rushed because of its general strong performance and ability to dominate the game, only stalled but not flat out countered by the pershing. Def doc against armor doc ALMOST ALWAYS was triumphant because armor doc was not equipped with dealing with hard defenses. Tank hunter doc against armor doc ALWAYS was triumphant because the entire doctrine was made to kill anything armor doc would have without getting a scratch in return. This plus MANY more factors lead to the pershing for armor doc ALWAYS being rushed because its CP availability timed very well with the tank depot being built and the tank as a whole was very good at countering any axis heavy tank while having the durability to last against any t3 or below unit. People seemed to enjoy games more when power advantages and game "comebacks' went back and forth for a while, so the goal with changing the CP structure is to extend phases of the game and lessen the impact of CP unlocks that create super power spikes that would block out entire build paths. For example, if the pershing is unlocked it basically makes the entire armor branch for blitz doc unusable. So by making the pershing come later, it gives a chances for certain units/doctrines to have a fighting chance in certain phases and make the game more enjoyable to play no matter which doctrine was picked. For example (and only ONE example of many), we knew that armor doctrine would almost always stomp out blitz doctrine. By changing the CP pathing AND unit availability, we created a new 1v1 scenario between the two doctrines. Now, armor doctrine gets combat engineers at t1, that makes it pretty close to even or stronger than blitz on the early stages. But blitz doc quickly gains strength going into the mid game with its storm troopers and quick availability of heavy tanks. Armor doctrine may have had advantages early game, but not enough to end the game. Blitz doc now has the capability to make a come back and turn the game around mid game, armor doc needs to change strategies and survive into the late game. Armor doc late game can more or less over power blitz doc armor, but by then blitz doc would have decent map control and stronger infantry to play around armor doctrine pershings. The end game is a face off of players who both can field combined arms with units that have dedicated roles.

If you are really having truoble against early axis tanks as blitz doc or terror doc, then stop tryign to rush pershings and simply go into the tank destroyer path to have jacksons out within 4 CP PLUS the benefits of having combat engineers now to clear off any axis infantry.

Markr wrote:
CroW_TaTToo wrote:aaaalso now you cant get the artillery pieces from a friend wy??? and dont tell me they dont have training its ok to make the artillery take ammo per minute but if this is implemented already there is no need to disable the unit if its broken because if i have the ammo and my team mate dont i can get the artillery piece and let it consume my ammo
Howitzers are doctrine-specific units, same as Pershings or Kingtigers. You also cannot build a Pershing, "kill" the crew and let your team-mates take it. One of the reasons why the howitzers were strong was that people just gave them to team-mates and the enemy had to fight against 6 or more howitzers (each team-mate had 2 or 3). If you have ammo and want to shoot arty, every doctrine has some arty unit. Not as strong as howitzers but they have arty. Use what your doctrine offers.


Also, now almost all doctrines have some form of indirect attack so there should be much less of a need to steal another teammate's doctrine specific unit.

Markr wrote:
CroW_TaTToo wrote:ps also wy propaganda doctrine¿¿¿ the doctrine its TERROR that include the propaganda game on it you do not batle whit paper propaganda is a way of inflict terror and descorage on the units but nor to call a doctrine like that terror wass the real name of that kind of warfare
It's not Terror anymore, it is Propaganda now. This doctrine gives you a chance to try some other play style than just "Axis = strong but expensive". It also gives you option to play more with abilities and less with raw strength.

Also, because people wanted this. See here: viewtopic.php?f=27&t=3295
The vote was pretty clear. It wasn't "our" decision.

Gurkenkilla wrote:Is there any rework for Scorched Earth planed? I'm feeling this doctrine being major useless in comparison to the other PE doctrines.

Probably no. The reworks are meant to make sure all doctrines can participate in 1v1's without big things missing. SE has tanks, infantry, and artillery. If it's useless because of balance reasons then it can be balanced, but not reworked.

@Sparrow
I've watched your replay. I think there were major team errors on both sides, but it definitely didn't look like Germans won before the game ended. You could have kept fighting for sure, your teammates still held the munition hill which is probably the most important part of the map, especially for airborne and infantry doctrines.

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