PvP 3 vs 3 Beta

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Warhawks97
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PvP 3 vs 3 Beta

Post by Warhawks97 »

Another game that shows how shitty allied tanks are.


Axis Tanks are made for attacks,
Allied Tanks are made to die.


Axis:
Wald
Figree
Ogro:

vs

Allied:
Malone
Mencius
Me


Towards the end of the game (and many other moments) even the cheapest garbage F2 Tank can just drive towards a 76 sherman and shoot it.




Another Problem is that axis get out Tanks always first. We had 3 games today and axis gets the tanks always first and forcing me to get 76 shermans or M10´s asap. Either its bc US lacks the fuel to keep up or the MP. The cal 50 upgrade doesnt make it better.


So you are left behind in tec, outgunned and outspammed. Its pure Frustration. We all literally enraged in Discord bc every fucking game, not matter if we lose or win, if we hold the map or not, playing allied is pure frustration. You need huge coordiantion and micro efforts to handle situations and survive late game.

As Axis you sit behind some stugs and F2´s, go afk and wait for stupid panthers or arty. And panthers drive into AT weapons and dont care at all. And at the same time there comes a super destructive rocket strike (Maultier or hotchkiss)..... and you are left behind with a fucked up little calli Jeep and its 6 missile that all hit shit.


So, as far as it goes for Wald, Mencius, Malone and others, we are fed up with this crap. We dont want to play allied just for nonstop Frustration.
You have to micro in defense and during attacks as allied. As axis you need a bit micro for attacking, else you sit behind your TD´s and stay save.
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Sparrow
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Re: PvP 3 vs 3 Beta

Post by Sparrow »

Only when pershings arrives to the very late game can do something, and by that time, if there is Panzer Support in the field, you may be ready to lost your heavy tanks.

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Krieger Blitzer
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Re: PvP 3 vs 3 Beta

Post by Krieger Blitzer »

I don't see the reference.. as i did have quite contrary experience; so many BETA games i have played when Allies (specifically US Armor and CW RE docs) simply overwhelmed Axis mid game with dozens of Shermans and Churchills.

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Warhawks97
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Re: PvP 3 vs 3 Beta

Post by Warhawks97 »

Krieger Blitzer wrote:
22 Jul 2020, 11:15
I don't see the reference.. as i did have quite contrary experience; so many BETA games i have played when Allies (specifically US Armor and CW RE docs) simply overwhelmed Axis mid game with dozens of Shermans and Churchills.
Join us on discord next time. We are several players there and each time we get pissed off when we play allied. For now we stopped playing them. Bc it doesnt matter if you have map controle or not. Stugs and F2´s are quick on the field (cheap and res trade in BK doc) and hold well enough until panthers.


The next annoying thing is that RA doc does not have achilles anymore and fireflies are barely a match for Panthers.

I think its this combo of cheap F2´s pressuring you everywhere and able to outspam tanks like firefly and on the other hand Panthers that outgun and outrange and outarmor everything.


The Achilles was so vital for the survival of RA doc. Now players constantly need to micro their fireflies and arty. I think arty doc needs achilles more than any other of the docs.
And the churchill for 3 CP in RA doc is pure nuts.

RAF and RE perform much better currently and leaving the arty role to US or whatever.


So far ive never managed to match the F2 spam in terms of sherman counterspam. Shermans require way more tec, cost more and the upkeep eats you and forces you to spend another billion ressources into the supply yard but by that point you do not only face Panzer IV F2´s but also stugs and Panthers so once again you are fucked up. If you have one F2 spam doc, a some stugs for mid game and later one player going for Panther you will be in serious trouble.

Going for Pershing isnt an option really bc that would force you to give up on cheap shermans, ammo upgrade and other stuff you might need. On top of that we dont want to be forced once again to play armor doc only for pershings. You wouldnt be able to hold of all the F2´s.


In any way, in this game we were about to leave several times bc its got so frustrating.


Whats also annyoing is the ammount of micro when playing allied tanks. Axis put a stug somewhere, rep bunker behind and dont need to worry anymore.


And when the enemie starts a somewhat bigger attack, just throw some rockets into his face and relax. The stug will do the rest.


If you place an M10 just like that you can be sure that you need to micro it even during your defense and then for the repairs.




I think what all pisses us most is the following:

Axis TD destroy attacking Tanks.
Allied Tanks get destroyed by Tanks.


Many times i put a M10 to support mates, even fucking 650 Mp jacksons. And when i asked what happend to them i get responds like: The enemie tanks drove up and killed it.


Yeah great, TD´s that get destroyed by their supposed victims when they try to ambush them. Thats really really great.




If you also noticed:
The only real way to overcome a solid stug defense with armor doc is using RL jeeps. I used two of them and killed one stug and damaged a second. If had used three of them i would have killed perhaps all stugs.


Isnt it silly that RL jeeps are the only unit that does the jobs which are supposed to be done by Tanks and tank destroyers?

We might rename armor doc into:
The RL´s jeep `n Pershing doc!



I Vote for armored RL jeeps and remove all the crapy shermans and M10´s and Jacksons. Add Veterancy level for RL jeeps as unlock and a RL jeep massproduction. No one needs these incapable fucktarded bullshit shit eater sherman crap tanks and their usless disabled M10 cousins!

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Krieger Blitzer
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Re: PvP 3 vs 3 Beta

Post by Krieger Blitzer »

Warhawks97 wrote:
22 Jul 2020, 11:47
Join us on discord next time. We are several players there and each time we get pissed off when we play allied.
it's not like i never joined you before.. nor that it's like i never played BETA beforehand, you know.

My experience was quite different on various games, Tulip Shermans can easily destroy Pz4s & Stugs from a far... Combat Engineers wipe out most Axis infantry in early game, US half-tracks with Zooka teams inside out-flank most Axis tanks. Hell, even Daimler & Chaffe can kill Pz4.F2 and Stugs!

I have seen Axis being dominated in 3v3 games, just the same way i had also seen Allies being dominated as well.. from what you say - however - you are trying to imply that Axis are always superior... Which is something i haven't experienced in the BETA especially when teams were balanced.

Achilles in RA doc (again) would be too much without a doubt.

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Warhawks97
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Re: PvP 3 vs 3 Beta

Post by Warhawks97 »

Krieger Blitzer wrote:
22 Jul 2020, 12:40


it's not like i never joined you before.. nor that it's like i never played BETA beforehand, you know.

you should have been there the past days, esspecially yesterday.

My experience was quite different on various games, Tulip Shermans can easily destroy Pz4s & Stugs from a far... Combat Engineers wipe out most Axis infantry in early game, US half-tracks with Zooka teams inside out-flank most Axis tanks. Hell, even Daimler & Chaffe can kill Pz4.F2 and Stugs!
combat engis are super squishy. One volley of the new k98 and two men are dead outright. In HR games its perhaps an option but even then. One motorcylce burst and its down. On top of that, when facing BK doc pios with Mp40 you have no real advantage anymore but you pay twice the price. 315 MP for a squishy close combat unit is a big deal and super risky choice. I tried it, believe me. Often enough they got shred during the retreat.


Daimler is brits. We get fucked up by the bad US weaponry mostly. Also we face usually one BK doc or two. So there are lots of AT rifles. Its not like people play so foolish and park a stug in the middle of the map. They secure bottleknecks and have support units behind.

Its funny btw bc Mencius said exactly that what you do now. He predicted it. When its about allies people take everything into consideration what they have available, even doctrinal stuff. But you cant have all 6 docs at once so you always trade off something.

And RA does not have Tulip or Achilles.


Also Tulip isnt that great. Yes, it sometimes hit. But mostly one missile misses, hits the dirt or whatever. I faced dozens of tulips bc thats the new CW hype ATM. But they are not as dangerous as most say. Its not like you dont need anything else. You can kill HT in a hit or finish of tanks. But up to now ive never seen a tank getting killed by it alone. And if you charge it you can shoot it often quick enough and move on before second missile is fired.

gl with chaffe. It comes pretty late. I had some funny dances and players believed it could stop the F2´s. But the F2´s are cheaper and mostly only the first ambush shot goes through. Dont tell me that you use chaffe to go head on with Pz4´s.

The chaffe is too squishy and costly at the time it comes up. Stugs have no issues at all dealing with them and various other weapons deal enough damage to it.


So no, its not really an option when you face players going staright for spam of cheap TD and cheap F2´s.
I have seen Axis being dominated in 3v3 games, just the same way i had also seen Allies being dominated as well.. from what you say - however - you are trying to imply that Axis are always superior... Which is something i haven't experienced in the BETA especially when teams were balanced.

Achilles in RA doc (again) would be too much without a doubt.
This doc is basically a sitting doc and Priest (and arty in general) isnt as good in killing tanks as it was once perhaps. You have three fireflies for defense but get still overruned by panthers bc without ambush the 17 pdr likes to bounce.

No other doc needs Achilles as much as RA. Arty isnt that usefull to counter tanks and you have no idea how to handle the permanent tank spam.


Axis are superior?

Well, lets put it this way:

Axis TD´s kill enemie tanks once they get in range.
Allis TD shoot, bounce or dont deal enough damage and get onehoted. I would almost say that so far the majority of my ambushes were a pure disaster, even if one shot penetrated. German TD´s are far more reliable in doing their job.


Not to mention tanks. Axis tanks are Tanks. Allied Tanks are.... basically idk what they are supposed to be. What i know is that they cant tank anything when compared to their german competitors.

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