Tank gunsight/periscope upgrades

[Warhawks97]

Due to the recent discussions about Panther G and being "armored scout" i wanna shortly point out current periscope buffs on Tanks.

Tanks with Gunsights (as upgrade):

Hetzer
Jagdpanzer IV (all three types)
Jagdpanther
Jagdtiger
Tigers (Early, late, ace)
King Tiger
Panther G
Pershing
Pershing Ace
Super Pershing


Right now it seems that all gunsights are basically crap. I checked all units that are produced (didnt check the call ins) and so far the buff a gunsight provides is just 15 sight range. Means i gave up using them on tigers when i have not a high ammo income.

Except Panther G. The sight range buff is 35 and also accuracy buffed by 1.5. And maybe not only the gun receives this accuracy but also the MG´s. That might explains why Panther G (esp with vet) shreds infantry better as all other tanks actually.


So my suggestion for Gunsights:

All of them should provide a sight range of + 20 or +25. That means All gunsights would be buffed from 15 to this value. Just Panther G optics lowered from 35 to the suggested value.

All of them should provide an accuracy buff of 1.15 or 1.2. That means all gunsights would provide accuracy bounuses. The Panther G accuracy buff would be lowered from 1.5 to this suggested values.

The Hetzer might be a bit different as it cost just 25 ammo. I would up cost from 25 ammo to 50 and it would provide similiar boost, just not as good as the others. Like instead 25 or 20 sight buff they would have 15 or 20 and so on.

The Panther G gunsight has the name FG 1250. It was a night vision tool that worked combined with an infrared spotlight mounted on a halftrack (COH 2 OKW HT with searchlight).

If it wouldnt make too much work you can rename the german once from "periscope" or what it is called into "TZF9" for Tiger and "TZF12" for Panther. Jagdpanzer with these guns simply had the name "ZF" (and the number). The Jagdppanzer IV /48 and hetzer probably used a "(T)ZF5".



That way we might make the Panther G being bit less being an "heavy armored recon" while making other gunsights better and worth their cost.

[Cyberzombie]

Totally support this idea!

[Wake]

I support this, but would go for standardizing every single periscope/gunsight upgrade. Every single one is the same upgrade, costs the same and gives the same bonuses.

[Warhawks97]

I support this, but would go for standardizing every single periscope/gunsight upgrade. Every single one is the same upgrade, costs the same and gives the same bonuses.

The Hetzer atm cost 25 and gives same (poor) boost as the others (except Panther G). As you can see this one would either stay with cost and boost or slight upped boost and slight upped boost. But i think Hetzer can be different to keep it generally as cheap anti tank option. Luft and SE (which also use it) need the ammo simply elsewhere so i prefer here cheaper gunsight for hetzer but also one that isnt as good as the others.

atm it seems that 3 are used (I will put the folders where you can find it in front of the name):

1. (upgrade\axis_pe\items) "panzer_elite_jagdpanther_spotting_scope.lua"
- this is used by basically all tanks (iirc), even pershing. It simply boosts sight range by 15 and costs 75 ammo.
2. (upgrade\axis_pe\items) "panzer_elite_hetzer_spotting_scope.lua"
- boosts sight range by 15 as well and costs 25 ammo.
3. (upgrade\axis_pe\items) "axis_panther_spotting_scope.lua"
- Boosts sight range by 35 and accuracy by 1.5 modifier. Used by Panther G.

Edit: We maybe have to keep in mind that the M20 command vehicle with range boost is boosting sight and run range by 10 temporarily in a radius of 40 and cost 50 ammo. We maybe increase the spotting range from 10 to 15. I forgot about it. Thats simply to keep the cost efficency with spotting scopes in line.

[Wake]

Edit: We maybe have to keep in mind that the M20 command vehicle with range boost is boosting sight and run range by 10 temporarily in a radius of 40 and cost 50 ammo. We maybe increase the spotting range from 10 to 15. I forgot about it. Thats simply to keep the cost efficency with spotting scopes in line.

The M20 Command Car acts just like the British Cromwell Command Tank, right? Any friendly tanks near it get bonuses to accuracy, etc? Except that the Command Car also has the three 50 munition abilities for Increased Accuracy, Increased Sight and Range, and Reduced receiving accuracy, correct?

[Butterkeks]

Also supported from me

[Devilfish]

Edit: We maybe have to keep in mind that the M20 command vehicle with range boost is boosting sight and run range by 10 temporarily in a radius of 40 and cost 50 ammo. We maybe increase the spotting range from 10 to 15. I forgot about it. Thats simply to keep the cost efficency with spotting scopes in line.

The M20 Command Car acts just like the British Cromwell Command Tank, right? Any friendly tanks near it get bonuses to accuracy, etc? Except that the Command Car also has the three 50 munition abilities for Increased Accuracy, Increased Sight and Range, and Reduced receiving accuracy, correct?

I was actually wondering this myself. Does M20 command car give any boosts to nearby tanks with only its presence? Just like british command tank? Or it does absolutely nothing without paying ammo for one of three abilities?

[Warhawks97]

It does nothing to nearby tanks unless you use one of his abilities. There is no passive boost, however it once had been or was planned as i found passive boosts for M20 in the ability folder. But apparently it never got passive boosts.

The advantage the M20 has is that the boosts affect tanks in a radius of 40, the command tank in a radius of 30 only which in my opinion is very small for BK. It forces you to cluster the tanks which eventually results in chaos and blocking (during retreats in particular) and your tanks are perfect arty targets.

[JimQwilleran]

I am up for the Hawk's idea, yet isn't it again something that many people talked about: "reducing diversity", "Now no unit will be special" etc?

[Warhawks97]

I am up for the Hawk's idea, yet isn't it again something that many people talked about: "reducing diversity", "Now no unit will be special" etc?

xD

i was just saying. But in old topic i was talking/suggesting something like that (tank commander removal as every tank has a commander or all have one at default who can step out. But since they give such massive boosts..... ). I dont consider it atm as the big issue.

We will simply assume that every tank has a commander and that the "special" one just replaces the "standard noob commander"

[sandman332]

I support this, but would go for standardizing every single periscope/gunsight upgrade. Every single one is the same upgrade, costs the same and gives the same bonuses.

The Hetzer atm cost 25 and gives same (poor) boost as the others (except Panther G). As you can see this one would either stay with cost and boost or slight upped boost and slight upped boost. But i think Hetzer can be different to keep it generally as cheap anti tank option. Luft and SE (which also use it) need the ammo simply elsewhere so i prefer here cheaper gunsight for hetzer but also one that isnt as good as the others.

atm it seems that 3 are used (I will put the folders where you can find it in front of the name):

1. (upgrade\axis_pe\items) "panzer_elite_jagdpanther_spotting_scope.lua"
- this is used by basically all tanks (iirc), even pershing. It simply boosts sight range by 15 and costs 75 ammo.
2. (upgrade\axis_pe\items) "panzer_elite_hetzer_spotting_scope.lua"
- boosts sight range by 15 as well and costs 25 ammo.
3. (upgrade\axis_pe\items) "axis_panther_spotting_scope.lua"
- Boosts sight range by 35 and accuracy by 1.5 modifier. Used by Panther G.

Edit: We maybe have to keep in mind that the M20 command vehicle with range boost is boosting sight and run range by 10 temporarily in a radius of 40 and cost 50 ammo. We maybe increase the spotting range from 10 to 15. I forgot about it. Thats simply to keep the cost efficency with spotting scopes in line.

Okay, makes sense, I agree with what should be done. But I'm also wondering, so the number 1 is used by all tanks, number 3 is used by only the Panther G. so what is the number 2 used in? Or is it not used in any tanks at all?

EDIT: My bad, didn't read properly lol, hetzer is right in the name so I would think it's only used in the hetzer tank. My bad.

[XAHTEP39]

...The Nashorn also has no gunsights which IV/70 later gets at default in that doc...

Damn! I don`t know about this, but it is unfair with respect to Nashorn
Nashorn is clearly defensive weapon and without good armor and open hull, it have only excelent gun.
Therefore Nashorn (in SE and TH, of course) really requires the upgrading periscope/gunsight (such as Hetzer/Jagdpanzers...) for good vision of battlefield.