Hotkey Suggestions
- Walderschmidt
- Posts: 1266
- Joined: 27 Sep 2017, 12:42
Hotkey Suggestions
Here are some hotkey suggestions for abilities that either don't have hotkeys, have the same hotkey, or have odd hotkeys (B for a smoke barrage instead of S for example).
MG Camoflage Hotkey is "C". I recommend changing it to "G" since hold position normally goes there. It also has a "P" Hotkey for AP burst. I recommend "N" since grenades are normally there. PaK 36 has no hotkey for its HE ability. I recommend "N" since it's in the grenade slot. LeIG has no barrage hotkey. I recommend "N" since it's in the grenade slot. CMD Stormtroopers have no hotkey for mortar barrage. I recommend "N" since it's in the grenade slot. StuG III & CMD PIV both have "B" for smoke barrage. I recommend "S" since they're in the sprint position and S is more common for smoke across the camo. Sniper Rapid Shots has no hotkey. I suggest "N" since it's in the grenade slot. AT-Squad has no hotkey for ambush. I suggest "N" since it's in the grenade slot. Wald
MG Camoflage Hotkey is "C". I recommend changing it to "G" since hold position normally goes there. It also has a "P" Hotkey for AP burst. I recommend "N" since grenades are normally there. PaK 36 has no hotkey for its HE ability. I recommend "N" since it's in the grenade slot. LeIG has no barrage hotkey. I recommend "N" since it's in the grenade slot. CMD Stormtroopers have no hotkey for mortar barrage. I recommend "N" since it's in the grenade slot. StuG III & CMD PIV both have "B" for smoke barrage. I recommend "S" since they're in the sprint position and S is more common for smoke across the camo. Sniper Rapid Shots has no hotkey. I suggest "N" since it's in the grenade slot. AT-Squad has no hotkey for ambush. I suggest "N" since it's in the grenade slot. Wald
Kwok is an allied fanboy!
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Generally asking, are players more in favor of having hotkeys
A) resemble the ability names (as in S for smoke)
or
B) prefer different keys each corresponding to an action tile in the GUI (for example QWER for the middle row and ASDF for the lower one)?
A) resemble the ability names (as in S for smoke)
or
B) prefer different keys each corresponding to an action tile in the GUI (for example QWER for the middle row and ASDF for the lower one)?
- Walderschmidt
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- Joined: 27 Sep 2017, 12:42
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
I'd prefer a consistent scheme where each square is given a corresponding key, whether it resembles an ability or not.
That way I could see a UI and know instantly what hotkey goes to what ability.
Wald
That way I could see a UI and know instantly what hotkey goes to what ability.
Wald
Kwok is an allied fanboy!
AND SO IS DICKY
AND MARKR IS THE BIGGGEST ALLIED FANBOI OF THEM ALL
AND SO IS DICKY
AND MARKR IS THE BIGGGEST ALLIED FANBOI OF THEM ALL
- TheUndying
- Posts: 53
- Joined: 11 Aug 2018, 22:55
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Can we revive this topic again, please?
The duplicate hotkeys and inconsistent mapping of hotkeys is slowly but surely driving me insane. I want my bois to sprint, not to throw smoke.
I would highly recommend option B - while it would take some time to re-learn some of the new hotkeys, at least you will know what button to press to sprint, pop smoke, retreat, fire HE etcetc.
The duplicate hotkeys and inconsistent mapping of hotkeys is slowly but surely driving me insane. I want my bois to sprint, not to throw smoke.
I would highly recommend option B - while it would take some time to re-learn some of the new hotkeys, at least you will know what button to press to sprint, pop smoke, retreat, fire HE etcetc.
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Some problems come to my mind. I'm not 100% sure but I think that the abilities in the first line of UI are hard-coded and "A" is already "Attack move", so that would mess up the the option "b".
Also, not every languange has the same keyboard layout. For example czech keyboards have swapped letters "Y" and "Z", so the top line goes "QWERTZ" and the bottom line goes "YXCV". So if we set up a "consistent scheme", it will not be consistent on the czech keyboard (unless you switch the language setting every time before you play a match.
I guess a solution could be making the consistent scheme going from the other side, so the UI's top line would be UIOP, mid line HJKL and bottom line VBNM. Although, it's possible that this scheme would be conflicting with keayboard layouts of some other languages.
Also, not every languange has the same keyboard layout. For example czech keyboards have swapped letters "Y" and "Z", so the top line goes "QWERTZ" and the bottom line goes "YXCV". So if we set up a "consistent scheme", it will not be consistent on the czech keyboard (unless you switch the language setting every time before you play a match.
I guess a solution could be making the consistent scheme going from the other side, so the UI's top line would be UIOP, mid line HJKL and bottom line VBNM. Although, it's possible that this scheme would be conflicting with keayboard layouts of some other languages.
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Yeah, vowels will probably clash in german keyboards, there are the letters ü, ö and ä added on the far right.
Maybe in the middle? :')
Maybe in the middle? :')
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Yes, but those vovels are "added" to the right side of the "basic" keyboard layout.
So why not just use what I said: Whatever has any language added to the side of the "basic" layout, won't be affected.
So why not just use what I said: Whatever has any language added to the side of the "basic" layout, won't be affected.
- TheUndying
- Posts: 53
- Joined: 11 Aug 2018, 22:55
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Do I understand your first paragraph correctly, as in that A is hard-coded to be Attack move? That would definitely complicate things. We'd have to assign hotkeys from scratch, then, to reach consistency.MarKr wrote: ↑02 Jun 2022, 08:48Some problems come to my mind. I'm not 100% sure but I think that the abilities in the first line of UI are hard-coded and "A" is already "Attack move", so that would mess up the the option "b".
Also, not every languange has the same keyboard layout. For example czech keyboards have swapped letters "Y" and "Z", so the top line goes "QWERTZ" and the bottom line goes "YXCV". So if we set up a "consistent scheme", it will not be consistent on the czech keyboard (unless you switch the language setting every time before you play a match.
I guess a solution could be making the consistent scheme going from the other side, so the UI's top line would be UIOP, mid line HJKL and bottom line VBNM. Although, it's possible that this scheme would be conflicting with keayboard layouts of some other languages.
Regarding the keyboard layout, that is indeed an issue (same with German keyboard where we also use QWERTZ) but I would prefer having to rethink Y and Z from time to time compared to having to remember every button or having overlapping hotkeys (S for sprint and smoke).
Not sure I like the UIOP idea as hotkeys should be easily reachable and imo those keys are not easy to reach (given how my hand usually rests atop WASD keys). Feel free to laugh at my tiny hands tho.
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
I found out that "attack move" and other abilities in the top row are not hard coded so we could re-assign the hotkeys and use the left scheme:
Top: QWER T
Mid: ASDF G
Bot: ZXCV B
Where the T/G/B could be slots for unit upgrades (weapons on infantry and ammo on tanks).
There is still the problem that some language keyboard layouts have letters swapped but Windows allows you to install English keyboard layout scheme for free and you can easily switch between the layouts by pressing Alt+Shift, so that would be all it takes to get the hotkeys working.
I will start working on it, but it will take some time as this applies not only to abilities but also to units in production buildings, build menus and whatnot and we have crapload of of them in the game.
Top: QWER T
Mid: ASDF G
Bot: ZXCV B
Where the T/G/B could be slots for unit upgrades (weapons on infantry and ammo on tanks).
There is still the problem that some language keyboard layouts have letters swapped but Windows allows you to install English keyboard layout scheme for free and you can easily switch between the layouts by pressing Alt+Shift, so that would be all it takes to get the hotkeys working.
I will start working on it, but it will take some time as this applies not only to abilities but also to units in production buildings, build menus and whatnot and we have crapload of of them in the game.
- Redgaarden
- Posts: 588
- Joined: 16 Jan 2015, 03:58
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Man super happy about it. Can't wait for all the complaints that will follow.
Edit: Hopefully it wont be that many
Edit: Hopefully it wont be that many
Rifles are not for fighting. They are for building!
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
would be more worth to spend this time on fixing se doctrine tech treeMarKr wrote: ↑19 Jun 2022, 10:20I found out that "attack move" and other abilities in the top row are not hard coded so we could re-assign the hotkeys and use the left scheme:
Top: QWER T
Mid: ASDF G
Bot: ZXCV B
Where the T/G/B could be slots for unit upgrades (weapons on infantry and ammo on tanks).
There is still the problem that some language keyboard layouts have letters swapped but Windows allows you to install English keyboard layout scheme for free and you can easily switch between the layouts by pressing Alt+Shift, so that would be all it takes to get the hotkeys working.
I will start working on it, but it will take some time as this applies not only to abilities but also to units in production buildings, build menus and whatnot and we have crapload of of them in the game.
- Redgaarden
- Posts: 588
- Joined: 16 Jan 2015, 03:58
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Is it too strong or too weak?
And there was the first complaint xD
And there was the first complaint xD
Rifles are not for fighting. They are for building!
-
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Can we have RE "hull down" moved from D key to not overlap with direct fire then?
- Krieger Blitzer
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Oh, speaking of that SE doc thingy again; i think it's more than just that.
The current SE doc layout does not align with the overall quality outlined for the game.
You might think it's not a big deal, but if we keep messing out with doctrinal arrows like that.. we will eventually end up with doctrinal items all over the place with wrong arrow directions here and there, for example it's like having the Super Pershing unlock linked to the Calliope unlock but without any indication that it does... just that the player "would need to play it for the first time so he can figure it out" which isn't ideal. If the Super Pershing indicates that it's linked to the normal Pershing unlock, then it must.
The same way, the SE doc is currently the only doctrine in the BETA that has messed up arrow directions. There is no reason or obligation that it has to be done this way, so i''m bewildered as to why not to amend it!
P.S
Speaking of hotkeys, the most important ones are "D" for direct fire, "H" for halt, "T" for retreat & "R" for reinforce... i think those shouldn't change.
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
So, because you didn't get the system the first time you played the game, it MUST lead to scenarios where doctrinal unlocks are connected even when they don't require each other? Yeah, right. When that happens, link me this post and the only thing you need to write to it is "I told you so." But until then, don't come up with these catastrophic scenarios when nothing even remotely that problematic is happening.
That is what the SE unlock tree shows - the Firestorm indicates it is linked to fire weapons and observation HT, and it is.Krieger Blitzer wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 00:47If the Super Pershing indicates that it's linked to the normal Pershing unlock, then it must.
Nope. In every doc, the arrow direction shows what you need to unlock first in order to unlock the thing the arrow leads to. In SE the observation HT leads to Firestorm, and Fire weapons lead to Firestorm. And you need observation HT and Fire weapons to get Firestorm. Just because you need both of them instead of just one doesn't mean the unlock path indicates wrong direction or whatever.Krieger Blitzer wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 00:47The same way, the SE doc is currently the only doctrine in the BETA that has messed up arrow directions.
OK, so 3 keys we need, shouldn't change...idea scrapped then...Krieger Blitzer wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 00:47P.S
Speaking of hotkeys, the most important ones are "D" for direct fire, "H" for halt, "T" for retreat & "R" for reinforce... i think those shouldn't change.
- Krieger Blitzer
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
I never said it's catastrophic.. it's not ideal is what i said, as it doesn't align with the overall quality.MarKr wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 08:05Nope. In every doc, the arrow direction shows what you need to unlock first in order to unlock the thing the arrow leads to. In SE the observation HT leads to Firestorm, and Fire weapons lead to Firestorm. And you need observation HT and Fire weapons to get Firestorm. Just because you need both of them instead of just one doesn't mean the unlock path indicates wrong direction or whatever.
From ur perspective; if it's working then u don't bother.. which is understandable.
However; from my perspective, i find it hard to see why it has to be done that way although it can be amended.
Firestorm is linked to both Observation HT & incendiary unlock, but those last 2 i just mentioned aren't linked to each other in any way, which is the problem... There is nothing displayed that explains why the player can't go straight from either of them directly to Firestorm (for 3 CP) apart from "they will just need to figure it out" and that isn't ideal at all.. i mean like, is there any kind of obligation it has to be done like that? You can always re-arrange the items until everything is indicated properly & generally makes more sense.. or u can even just allow Firestom at 3 CP which could be a much easier solution in case u think it's a hassle to re-organise the doctrinal items again.
Never said u need to scrap the idea, i am just trying to save you time.. as i am aware it's going to take you too much effort to re-assign the hotkeys, so i had to mention those 4 as people commonly are used to them how they are currently... So, i was just trying to highlight that, not telling u what u need to do, but trying to just help.OK, so 3 keys we need, shouldn't change...idea scrapped then...
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
I guess I just understood this as a catastrophic prediction:
Well, sorry, my bad.Krieger Blitzer wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 00:47if we keep messing out with doctrinal arrows like that.. we will eventually end up with doctrinal items all over the place with wrong arrow directions here and there, for example it's like having the Super Pershing unlock linked to the Calliope unlock but without any indication that it does
And I would say it isn't problem at all. You unlock e.g. the observation HT and the Firestorm doesn't light up as available even if you have the 1 CP for it. What could it mean when there is the other arrow pointing at it? If it is such a deal breaker, we can put it into the Firestorm unlock description.Krieger Blitzer wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 12:06but those last 2 i just mentioned aren't linked to each other in any way, which is the problem...
No, there isn't. And there also isn't any obligation not to do it this way.Krieger Blitzer wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 12:06is there any kind of obligation it has to be done like that?
It is now 5CPs, because fewer felt it would come too early and more felt unjustified. The ability is underperforming now, so it isn't worth the 5 CP but the performance will be adjusted. If we put it down the arty line, then we're delaying Hotckiss and/or Hummel, which is not desirable. If we put it behind Hummel (and keep the ammo HT unlock) the Firestorm will be available too late and for too many CPs. If we remove the ammo HT, Firestorm will still be available too late and we'll need another unlock to replace the ammo HT (and no, we're not giving SE any "Ass.Pio training"). If we keep Firestorm where it is and "unlink" it from the the arty line, it will be just 3 CPs, which is too low. If we set it to 5 CPs, we'll need to take those 2CPs from somewhere but the current CP costs feel alright so that things don't come too soon or too late. This way it is 5 CPs in total and it doesn't require players to go too deep some unlock line just to get hands on an offmap ability.
I get it but 3 of those 4 are on the "left side QWERT" layout so if people start asking for reworks with "but keep ability X hotkey where it is" then the whole layout system is pointless.Krieger Blitzer wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 12:06Never said u need to scrap the idea, i am just trying to save you time.. as i am aware it's going to take you too much effort to re-assign the hotkeys, so i had to mention those 4 as people commonly are used to them how they are currently... So, i was just trying to highlight that, not telling u what u need to do, but trying to just help.
- Krieger Blitzer
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
Now that's some logical reasoning.. thx for sharing.MarKr wrote: ↑20 Jun 2022, 12:53No, there isn't. And there also isn't any obligation not to do it this way.
It is now 5CPs, because fewer felt it would come too early and more felt unjustified. The ability is underperforming now, so it isn't worth the 5 CP but the performance will be adjusted. If we put it down the arty line, then we're delaying Hotckiss and/or Hummel, which is not desirable. If we put it behind Hummel (and keep the ammo HT unlock) the Firestorm will be available too late and for too many CPs. If we remove the ammo HT, Firestorm will still be available too late and we'll need another unlock to replace the ammo HT (and no, we're not giving SE any "Ass.Pio training"). If we keep Firestorm where it is and "unlink" it from the the arty line, it will be just 3 CPs, which is too low. If we set it to 5 CPs, we'll need to take those 2CPs from somewhere but the current CP costs feel alright so that things don't come too soon or too late. This way it is 5 CPs in total and it doesn't require players to go too deep some unlock line just to get hands on an offmap ability.
However, i don't really think FireStorm at 3 CP would be too low.. even after the upcoming buff.
People only complained it was too early because SE doc had 2 off-maps early available.. but now Sector Arty got removed, & Firestorm still costs 200 ammo with red flares... i mean, inf doc has cheaper 105mm off-map for only 2 CP with no red flares; not complaining about it tho, it's fine.. but therefore i don't think FireStorm at 3 CP would be anything bad... Depends on how much u r going to buff it though, but generally speaking; i think it's fine at 3 CP as long as the red flares are there, regardless of performance.
I think majority hotkeys currently make sense where they are, up to you tho.. but u don't really need to re-work all hotkeys. First, because i personally would never request such a thing since it's a huge workload.. second; most keys are fine now, just few contradictions that could be re-addressed.I get it but 3 of those 4 are on the "left side QWERT" layout so if people start asking for reworks with "but keep ability X hotkey where it is" then the whole layout system is pointless.
- Redgaarden
- Posts: 588
- Joined: 16 Jan 2015, 03:58
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
agreed. either rework all the hotkeys or none.I get it but 3 of those 4 are on the "left side QWERT" layout so if people start asking for reworks with "but keep ability X hotkey where it is" then the whole layout system is pointless.
Rifles are not for fighting. They are for building!
Re: Hotkey Suggestions
However, Tiger mentioned the Reinforce button which I forgot about.
Green = ability panel
Orange = unit upgrades
Brown = Reinforce
Would this work?Green = ability panel
Orange = unit upgrades
Brown = Reinforce
- Krieger Blitzer
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
To be fair; while the idea of the re-work sounds cool.. yet, i think it's not worth the effort.
Most players are wired to the current hotkey layout, so i would encourage to keep the current setup but only re-assign any contradictions that get to be reported on individual basis.
P.S
As for FireStorm, i highly suggest to unlink it from the arty line and keep it at 3 CP, if players start complaining that it's OP; it can go back to 5 CP then.
Although i doubt anyone would complain since it has red flares alarm.
- Walderschmidt
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
This would work - put it in beta?
I like it a lot.
As for firestorm, please keep discussion of that in the firestorm thread.
Wald
Kwok is an allied fanboy!
AND SO IS DICKY
AND MARKR IS THE BIGGGEST ALLIED FANBOI OF THEM ALL
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Re: Hotkey Suggestions
i dont see a retreat button here. Also do we really need to overhaul entire hotkey setup if we only need to fix some overlaps?