Munitions Halftrack

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Walderschmidt
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Munitions Halftrack

Post by Walderschmidt »

What to do with this bad bois?

As of right now, all they do is let squads (and tanks?) upgrade outside of base sectors/next to certain buildings. That's it. They cost muni and fuel to build in addition to MP. Don't actually save you MP, just some time and micro by...making you take time and micro to get them to squads that need them. And most squads can upgrade weapons as long as they're in friendly territory.

So any ideas?

I have several?

1) Give their abilities to normal halftracks to make normal halftracks more useful.
2) Rename them munition carriers and have them decrease barrages of arty pieces by 1/3 or 1/2.
3) Give them the ability to lay mines for decreased price? Or make them decrease mine building cost of pioneers/engies by 1/3 or 1/2 (including demos!)
4) Give them ability that can affect a squad where a squad gets a free grenade throw?

Wald
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AND SO IS DICKY

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Warhawks97
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by Warhawks97 »

1. When placed near arty units, cooldown gets reduced.
2. All other units near a ammo HT have no cooldowns on their abilties (except perhaps ALRS and such brutal abilties, but nades, suppressive etc).
3. Mortars dont pay ammo for barrages when near ammo HT
4. Laying mines.

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mofetagalactica
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by mofetagalactica »

Warhawks97 wrote:1. When placed near arty units, cooldown gets reduced.
2. All other units near a ammo HT have no cooldowns on their abilties (except perhaps ALRS and such brutal abilties, but nades, suppressive etc).
3. Mortars dont pay ammo for barrages when near ammo HT
4. Laying mines.


agree agree agree https://media1.tenor.com/images/7845056 ... id=5751293

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CGarr
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by CGarr »

I support 1, 3, and 4 but I think it'd make more sense to give the no cooldown on abilities to normal HT's so people would build them more often, mixing up the light vehicle game a bit (currently don't see normal halftracks very often despite them being available quite early, especially the german ones). 2 could make sense on a muni halftrack but it shouldnt be exclusively on that unit, the other utilities are enough for it to not be useless so it wouldn't have to be unique in having that ability. (especially having a dedicated minelayer). A couple more abilities that'd be cool to see are goliath production from the muni HT and maybe the ability to hulldown so they're less squishy (especially considering they're unarmed).

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Warhawks97
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by Warhawks97 »

In vcoh the whole purpose of ammo carriers (only available for PE) was to eliminate cooldowns on PE abilties such as nades and special mortar shots.

I think its still the case for PE, havent tested it.

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CGarr
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by CGarr »

Warhawks97 wrote:In vcoh the whole purpose of ammo carriers (only available for PE) was to eliminate cooldowns on PE abilties such as nades and special mortar shots.

I think its still the case for PE, havent tested it.


I see what you're saying but I think giving that specific utility to the normal HT's as well would make them a more common sight without really taking away the muni HT's extra utilities, which would be nice since the game generally boils down to everyone rushing to get their armor as soon as reasonably possible because light vehicles are so much harder to use due to their lack of mobility and mobile firepower (kiting isn't really an option on maps that aren't flat open fields due to the slow turret rotation times and poor mobility offroad alongside the tendency for units to just turn on point instead of reversing which can be somewhat minimalized but still happens often enough to cause light vehicles to die when they shouldn't). As such, seeing increased firepower on light vehicles in general would be nice as well as an emphasis on the use of passive support units like the muni HT.

Having the muni HT as a minelayer and support for arty would both bring a new mechanic to the game (supports specific to indirect fire units) and improve on one that is currently pretty underutilized (minelaying). These two (3 but i'm counting the cooldown reduction and mortar fire cost drop as 1) abilities add a good amount of utility to the unit already, so while having the 0 second cooldown on frontline unit abilities would be nice, it doesn't necessarily need to be unique to the muni HT and would make more sense on the normal HT since that unit will probably be closer to the frontline units more often while the muni HT is off doing its thing with the mines and support for arty units.

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Warhawks97
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by Warhawks97 »

The normal HT is a very common sight. Some people even have their entire unit build up made arround it. Just check some replays. Normal HT´s dont need more utility. They are cheap, reinforce units nearby, transport units and can use an MG when it is transporting someone. PE´s HT always have a gunner.

I dont know if it really needs more utility like removing cooldowns an some abilties, esspecially as most of them are some sort of "ammo related" like nades, stickies etc. At least i would say that such capabilities should exclusively to ammo transports.

kwok
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by kwok »

Warhawks97 wrote:The normal HT is a very common sight. Some people even have their entire unit build up made arround it. Just check some replays. Normal HT´s dont need more utility. They are cheap, reinforce units nearby, transport units and can use an MG when it is transporting someone. PE´s HT always have a gunner.

I dont know if it really needs more utility like removing cooldowns an some abilties, esspecially as most of them are some sort of "ammo related" like nades, stickies etc. At least i would say that such capabilities should exclusively to ammo transports.


Just here to say that figree has told me the direct opposite, that there is nearly NO reason to get the halftrack. But I'll let him clarify/debate.

If you all can come to a consensus that'd be great....

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CGarr
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by CGarr »

kwok wrote:
Warhawks97 wrote:The normal HT is a very common sight. Some people even have their entire unit build up made arround it. Just check some replays. Normal HT´s dont need more utility. They are cheap, reinforce units nearby, transport units and can use an MG when it is transporting someone. PE´s HT always have a gunner.

I dont know if it really needs more utility like removing cooldowns an some abilties, esspecially as most of them are some sort of "ammo related" like nades, stickies etc. At least i would say that such capabilities should exclusively to ammo transports.


Just here to say that figree has told me the direct opposite, that there is nearly NO reason to get the halftrack. But I'll let him clarify/debate.

If you all can come to a consensus that'd be great....


I personally almost never see them unless the map is enormous. I myself use them somewhat often but there's almost always a better option for the scenario, I just like the idea of supporting inf through more than purely fire support but you cant deploy units or anything from standard HT's so there's not much reason to get them over a FOB unless you really want a (slow) mobile MG platform. Also, somewhat unrelated but now that I think about it the Kangaroo carrier its reward variant would probably be more common if they shared the same utility that HT's do since brits don't have an HT.

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mofetagalactica
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by mofetagalactica »

Standard HT's are weird, they're used but not that much as you think off, since there are better units at doing the same job also cheaper.

Ambulance Truck (Inf doc)
Ambulance HT (PE)
Ambulance CW Truck

If WH would get an ambulance HT then no-one would pick the standard HT cause you're stupid if you just want to pay more for having 1 MG on the top that would completely delay your early fuel investment options.

You want them as a true "common sight"? Then make them cheaper on Fuel cost and give them the hability to spawn basic infantry on the frontline (Volks/Greens/Mortars/Bazooka team), like the pzb WH halftrack wich can spawn AT's.

Also Ambulance HT's such as PE and CW ones should get an hability to spawn 2 medic models that recover wounded units from the ground like the ambulance truck one of USA.

Off topic:

I think the nerf to ambulance units on the amount of models that you need to recover to regain a full squad is too much, if someones want to make a pool about would be great (if i don't see it on these days i will make it).

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Warhawks97
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by Warhawks97 »

well, the ambulance units are usually always prefered over normal HT´s. I use the normal HT for my captain. As WH i play most of the time BK doc and there i usually get the storms HT in 99% of all cases.


I think medic HT´s that heal and reinforce should cost more than regular HT´s. In case of inf doc i would leave it simply bc that thing is not really and HT and dies quickly to small arms and need to be deployed.


I think medic HT´s and vehicles should all have the ability to go stationary which would increase heal radius and perhaps makes them collecting wounded.


Normal HT´s can get cheaper in the late game like max 200 MP or so.


And as we speak about healing:
Is anything in sight how to make it better for US? Paying 300 MP is a pain and since the change in spawning new squads, its nearly impossible to use that "feature" of spawning new squads. So chances here to drop the cost finally?


So if you would manage to somehow seperate healing stations and collecting wounded, that would be great. In that case medic HT´s would just heal.

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Walderschmidt
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by Walderschmidt »

Warhawks97 wrote:1. When placed near arty units, cooldown gets reduced.
2. All other units near a ammo HT have no cooldowns on their abilties (except perhaps ALRS and such brutal abilties, but nades, suppressive etc).
3. Mortars dont pay ammo for barrages when near ammo HT
4. Laying mines.
Bump. I vote for Warhawk's changes.

Wald
Kwok is an allied fanboy!

AND SO IS DICKY

AND MARKR IS THE BIGGGEST ALLIED FANBOI OF THEM ALL

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CGarr
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by CGarr »

Walderschmidt wrote:
13 Mar 2020, 03:28
Warhawks97 wrote:1. When placed near arty units, cooldown gets reduced.
2. All other units near a ammo HT have no cooldowns on their abilties (except perhaps ALRS and such brutal abilties, but nades, suppressive etc).
3. Mortars dont pay ammo for barrages when near ammo HT
4. Laying mines.
Bump. I vote for Warhawk's changes.

Wald
I agree

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mofetagalactica
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by mofetagalactica »

What about the option to deploy weapons on the ground like the EAW one does? and also a set up hability that deploys 2 engies to repair close vehicles.

That would open new strategies to equip squads with weapons they're not able to get normally.

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CGarr
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by CGarr »

mofetagalactica wrote:
21 Mar 2020, 02:28
What about the option to deploy weapons on the ground like the EAW one does? and also a set up hability that deploys 2 engies to repair close vehicles.

That would open new strategies to equip squads with weapons they're not able to get normally.
Not sure if this would create balance issues but I like it. Might need to take a look at the weapon upgrade slots on some inf squads during implementation though. I personally don't mind crazy strong combos being a possibility from the supply truck as long as everyone has access but I can see where the devs might take issue with it in terms of there being a lot to balance.

MenciusMoldbug
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by MenciusMoldbug »

Bumping this because one thing that really should happen with ammo trucks/halftracks is they should remove munition costs from mortars. Would be probably one of the reasons to actually build them rather than being a filler unit.

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sgtToni95
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Re: Munitions Halftrack

Post by sgtToni95 »

I like Hawk's idea too

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