Air patrols solution

[Shanks]

It can not be that the henschel killed so many tanks, like the US planes, which also kills infantry, they only ask you for 200 and 280 ammo, respectively, I was using these doctrines, and it is really stupid that I killed so many tanks, that consume cash and fuel .... I really think, that the solution, is not to improve the AA of all the factions, it would be better, to increase the cost of ammunition, since in a 3v3, for example, it is easy to reach these amounts, for the patrols, from 200 munitions of henschel, to 300 ammunition, and for the USA, from 280 ammunition to 340 ammunition, since it has supplies that easily give it ammunition, for now this is in general what I propose, take into account note that there are other types of artillery almost as destructive, such as the stukas, long tomp, 280 mm, 105mm, 155mm, which in itself do great damage, not to mention that when you have tanks, you usually find many obstacles, such as AT , I think this will force people to capture points, of ammunition for example, to have more and to subtract production from the enemy, and to resort to basic units ...or another solution, they could increase the fuel points in the maps, is what I think, any comment, are welcome!

[mofetagalactica]

And you didn't even saw what the artillery sector from PE can do, with practically no coldown and being active for almost 1 min.

Henschel's are stupid. At least with AB They only shoot inside the radio zone.

[sgtToni95]

I find sector ability cooldown quite annoying too.. just it has a high cost, and spending 200 ammo continuously is not always possible

[Warhawks97]

300 and 340 is too high. I mean these abilties are there to be used. And you cant expect everybody is playing high income maps all day. There are maps (graves bridges, fields of engagment) where you get lots of MP but not that much ammo or only with many small points. Generally, no ability should be above 300 (which should really be the absolute max). Otherwise people will be too scary to use them. Its not that it is a 100% success ability. It depends how many units are in the area, sight, move of units, fog of war etc etc. So it can be absolutely worthy the cost or absolutely unworthy. Several coditions have to be met in order to reach the wished ammount of destruction. The most deadly off map is the def doc 280 or 320 mm rocket strike and even that one doesnt deserve such costs. If anything change the cooldowns, but not the cost. My personal point of view that no ability should cost above 250 ammo. I dont want doctrine unlocks wasted with abilties that can be only used in a few occassions on even less maps.

Ever increasing cost to "balance" something brings more desturction to the mod. Ever increasing build costs, upkeeps, useage cost or more and more limitations ruin all fun and restricting the gameplay and flow too much.

[sgtToni95]

Fun that you posted this, and Lehr posted about Air patrol being ineffective due to aa lol. I guess theese two threads might help each other lol

[mofetagalactica]

Fun that you posted this, and Lehr posted about Air patrol being ineffective due to aa lol. I guess theese two threads might help each other lol

I would like to see something like we see with usa air patrol wich is almost immune to AA's but they only shoot inside the circle. I would like to see the same for henschel, being much harder to hit for aa's but only shooting inside the zone.

[Shanks]

@Warhawks97-I do not think it's much, 300 or 340 of ammunition, considering that they could eliminate a unit like the SP, 1900 MP, or the KT 1200 and 210 fuel (the cheapest, if I'm not wrong), and also destroys the tanks that are with them, like tanks with HE (90 minicion), among others, and as I said before, all this alone, for 200 or 280 munitions .... Not even, it gives you time to rearm, and what worst of all, when you have your tanks again, this skill will be enabled again, and at a low price ..... 300 and 340 is a fair cost, because you will have the security that you will do your job !; As I said before, there is also more artillery in combination, like, 280mm and long tomp, keep this in mind ... also, if you do not like, this idea, we could increase the reuse time of this skill, but I sincerely believe that this, will not work, because the first time you use it, it will cause the desired damage! ... or another serious idea, have higher fuel points, I think, in this way, it will not be "so painful" lose tanks ", but this would affect the game early and middle, it would not be a good idea, maybe .... the AA, they already do the damage they have to do, in my opinion, so, increase the fire capacity of these, perhaps, make the patrols unusable, it would be better, simply, to increase the price of the air patrols, would be good

@sgtToni95-our friend lehr, apparently does not know, the destructive power of the henschel, is unstoppable!

[Warhawks97]

oh come on. I played BK over years and we had time with insane high costs of these abilties. Nobody used and AA was more crap as now. Its quite easy that esspecially those two can fail, esspecially AB patrole. Take enemies sight, move, have lots of AA or just dont build expensive units when the threads are known. I never used SP, esspecially not vs luft. Same goes for jagdtiger and elephant. Sure this makes the ability looking pretty nice but how often does it happen?

I prefer dynamic games with some powerfull abilties that can simply bring some destructive power. But also at good costs. This reduces te usage of the ability to a very few very specific moments with high risk of failure. And what "security" are you talking about?
On top of that it should be possible to use several global abilties in a row during a well planned and exercised offensive. This would make it impossible. So just no from my side. Fail chance, (chance of) low cost efficiency, maps and all the other requirments for a successfull use wouldnt be in line anymore with such price increase.

[Shanks]

How are you going to play a dynamic game, with this profitable anti-tank ability? Or maybe you want me to play with spam infantry? ... I also did not say that I happened to remove SP jagdtiger or whatever, I was just giving an example of what profitable that is this ability! ... if all this was not enough, in addition to having good infantry, the luft has hetzers and Panthers. understand my point? ... it is necessary to have a tank against this doctrine, and you can not come to say , "just do not use armor against luft", if you tell me that, you contradict yourself, "there will be no dynamic game", besides, I am not one of those who likes a doctrine, completely delete another! It is stupid and it is not dynamic, although on the other hand ... USA is not designed to defeat PE, but in the same way, it is not good for one doctrine to completely suppress another, even the RE doctrine is very affected by airplanes, even more with the nerfed of the comet

[Panzer-Lehr-Division]

@Warhawks97-I do not think it's much, 300 or 340 of ammunition, considering that they could eliminate a unit like the SP, 1900 MP, or the KT 1200 and 210 fuel (the cheapest, if I'm not wrong), and also destroys the tanks that are with them, like tanks with HE (90 minicion), among others, and as I said before, all this alone, for 200 or 280 munitions .... Not even, it gives you time to rearm, and what worst of all, when you have your tanks again, this skill will be enabled again, and at a low price ..... 300 and 340 is a fair cost, because you will have the security that you will do your job !; As I said before, there is also more artillery in combination, like, 280mm and long tomp, keep this in mind ... also, if you do not like, this idea, we could increase the reuse time of this skill, but I sincerely believe that this, will not work, because the first time you use it, it will cause the desired damage! ... or another serious idea, have higher fuel points, I think, in this way, it will not be "so painful" lose tanks ", but this would affect the game early and middle, it would not be a good idea, maybe .... the AA, they already do the damage they have to do, in my opinion, so, increase the fire capacity of these, perhaps, make the patrols unusable, it would be better, simply, to increase the price of the air patrols, would be good

@sgtToni95-our friend lehr, apparently does not know, the destructive power of the henschel, is unstoppable!

I as pe player know pretty well that it is strong. @Toni i was talking about aa's not any patrol or henschel and if so then as example.

[milekh]

I think Henshel patrol deal too much damadge. it could be like 37/50mm AT with obviously high penetration and low accuracy, so one Hsh can kill one medium tank in one fly.
It is much better than P47, becouse you cant dodge them, and even have less time to react becouse it shots way before its above the target. so i think it should be like 280ammo and less effective (deal less damadge)

P47 airpatrol is also OP and brings a lot of chaos but still you can just move your units to dodge straffic and bombing runs.

[Warhawks97]

air raids are very dependable in general. I wouldnt change the damage, but if anything increase cost. Or increase the cooldown of the ability.

I have no opinion currently, just i am saying that lower damage wouldnt be so great.