M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

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Shanks
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M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 05 Oct 2017, 02:50

I think that this unit could really give you an easy victory, if you use it well, and that's not right, I tell you because: You only need the second Truck, the British "infantry truck" to have access to this wonderful vehicle, that costs only 300 MP and 35 of fuel + 25 of ammunition, and you have at your disposal a good vehicle against vehicles and ultra good against infantry, you can use HE and the most terrible thing is that you can use artillery only with only 25 of ammunition, causing a serious damage to the troops of the axis, without needing to enable something in the tree of the RA, in sintensis you only have to choose the doctrine, "no need to use CP", nor does it have a limit of units, I really think that it could create a great imbalance in the games. But to take this unit from the British, it would also cause problems with the mortars, I think, I say this, because I have not yet seen someone, use British, who has not suffered against 81 mm mortars in general, but I'm getting off the subject, because only in this doctrine, the British is easier to counter mortars, but is another matter, which I would like to discuss later. Someone could give me an idea to solve the problem ?. I propose that this vehicle be limited in 2 units maximum, and also that its ability of artillery be unlocked in the tree of doctrine, minimum with 4 CP. Do not forget that it is a mobile unit like the Priest
Note:sorry for the google translate lol

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sgtToni95
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby sgtToni95 » 05 Oct 2017, 07:45

I think limiting this unit to 2 would not break the doctrine so much, and i agree HE shots are very good (i've seen them oneshotting Fallshirm squads, so that CAN happen).

Just i think it already has to buy HE ammo after it's produced to use both its anti infantry and artillery capabilities, and has to spend ammo every time for both uses which in the mid-early phase of the game it appears is not that cheap, so i don't really think it needs a further delay to theese.

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Warhawks97
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Warhawks97 » 07 Oct 2017, 02:37

Isnt it limited to two already? not sure. But i never saw more than two so i assume there is a limit.

The unit is doctrinal and very often the only quick enough available arty that prevents that axis will simply trench in and start camping. Its strong, yes, but its in a doc focused on arty. Many axis docs that are not focused on arty have quite early arty available that can smash any mid game defense. They cost more but they are in a non doc arty. Also its very good against soft targets when used as arty, excellent against mid game defenses that prevents camping attempts.

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Shanks
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 07 Oct 2017, 10:58

Warhawks97 wrote:Isnt it limited to two already? not sure. But i never saw more than two so i assume there is a limit.

The unit is doctrinal and very often the only quick enough available arty that prevents that axis will simply trench in and start camping. Its strong, yes, but its in a doc focused on arty. Many axis docs that are not focused on arty have quite early arty available that can smash any mid game defense. They cost more but they are in a non doc arty. Also its very good against soft targets when used as arty, excellent against mid game defenses that prevents camping attempts.


are unlimited, and are not harmless, in addition ... quote the early game axis gunners that are so effective.120 mm? in particular, was never a problem for me

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Warhawks97
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Warhawks97 » 07 Oct 2017, 12:56

Never said its harmless. Just that its good against soft targets and thus excellent to prevent heavy camp games from mid game onwards.

I dont get your "quote" thing and i dont understand what you mean with 120 mm.

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idliketoplaybetter
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby idliketoplaybetter » 07 Oct 2017, 17:05

Agree to Warhawks.

It is only arty doc unit and i've never seen a game with more than 1-2 of those (considering dmg it deals, its not even "thaaaaaat usefull".., doesnt really denies fact, that light arty unit has direct HE ability though.
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Shanks
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 07 Oct 2017, 17:26

this unit can kill infantry, with direct fire, of one or two, for each shot, without using "HE", it can also destroy light vehicles, like the puma, and "leave at the same time", sometimes faster than puma. You can also target targets at a great distance, only for 25 ammunition, "6 shots", is gaining experience fast, and becomes very precise. What axis unit can do this in mid game? (120 mm, I referred to the mortar of PE with the SE)

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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby idliketoplaybetter » 07 Oct 2017, 17:29

Cut it off, and arty doc will suffer even more being not as that arty, as normally u need (suppose) it to
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Shanks
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 07 Oct 2017, 18:43

RA is the strongest arty Doc of the game, I did not say that the unit is eliminated, I just asked to limit the unit, in 2, and also to remove the HE, since it would be a very strong unit, if at least not has a weak point, it is enough to kill like a sniper, practically

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idliketoplaybetter
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby idliketoplaybetter » 07 Oct 2017, 21:01

None of ur points are bad. It's just, limiting unit to 2 only, wont make a big difference. Cause again, i personally never seen a game with more than 1-2 of those being successfully used, unless it is one of those common mid type played games, when people simply bank for arty, and that's how the game goes..has nothing to do with units/balance anymore, but just players.

If its able to "directfire/noHE/oneshotinfantry", imo, that seems rather broken, but never seen it myself as well.
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Shanks
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 07 Oct 2017, 22:54

well, if you think it's not a problem, okay, I just suggested

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Redgaarden
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Redgaarden » 08 Oct 2017, 01:19

It's way too inaccurate which makes it impossible to dodge and can be spammed the entire game with only 25 muni. I think it's random nature and spamability does not really fit the british doc.

No idea how to fix the problem though.
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Tiger1996 » 08 Oct 2017, 06:44

I think the actual problem about this RA doc 75mm half-track, is the fact that it's currently available earlier than any mortar half-tracks.
Let's not forget that mortar half-tracks were delayed few patches ago.. this 75mm half-track from RA doc has always been a tough counter to mortars.
Therefore, I must say that it's kinda odd how this thing is now available earlier! Limiting it wouldn't solve the problem though, as I believe that the best option is to actually delay it on the other hand...

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idliketoplaybetter
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby idliketoplaybetter » 08 Oct 2017, 08:10

Shanks wrote:well, if you think it's not a problem, okay, I just suggested


I didint really say, that it is not a problem.
But arty doc can be harmfull only in a few specific occasions.

Warhawks97 wrote: The unit is doctrinal and very often the only quick enough available arty that prevents that axis will simply trench in and start camping. Its strong, yes, but its in a doc focused on arty


Exactly what i meant by "specific players/slow early-mid game". It has less and less to do with units.
U go arty to break that thing down. To rush the hive, unless u do it "early enough" - gg
There is no other need in Arty doc aside of that, least in my eyes.


.., id rather figure out what to do with imbecil use of Arty recon units.
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Shanks
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 08 Oct 2017, 11:14

idliketoplaybetter wrote:
Shanks wrote:well, if you think it's not a problem, okay, I just suggested


I didint really say, that it is not a problem.
But arty doc can be harmfull only in a few specific occasions.

Warhawks97 wrote: The unit is doctrinal and very often the only quick enough available arty that prevents that axis will simply trench in and start camping. Its strong, yes, but its in a doc focused on arty


Exactly what i meant by "specific players/slow early-mid game". It has less and less to do with units.
U go arty to break that thing down. To rush the hive, unless u do it "early enough" - gg
There is no other need in Arty doc aside of that, least in my eyes.


.., id rather figure out what to do with imbecil use of Arty recon units.


please, i do not want to read things like, for example .... "axis camping" as if it were a big problem .... the allies can also "camp", it is normal, on the other hand, I see that the problem real of the British, is the absence of a good basic mortar, which makes it depend on this type of unit, and I think it is wrong, because this is how the imbalance begins...Or maybe it's just my impression.

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idliketoplaybetter
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby idliketoplaybetter » 08 Oct 2017, 12:43

U missread it totally, and interprate it somehow weird.

We are talking about RA doc. So im only talking from this perspective. I didnt confront, or argue, or point that others can/can't do anything alike.


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sgtToni95
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby sgtToni95 » 08 Oct 2017, 14:48

I don't really think brits lack a good basic mortar, it's just not really suitable for your kind of indirect-fire harassing playstyle.

I know HE shots on autocar is really good now, just i don't think it's really that balance breaking. And RA doc is really ONLY arty more than a plan brit: no inf buffs, no fortification buffs, no big tanks, no resources excange. Just artillery units that basic brit doesn't have. Weaken its arty and the really few fancy units it has and this doctrine would suffer a lot imo.

Autocar scatter is really a lot based on RNG.. once you start seing shots landing you must be really unlucky or distracted to suffer a real pain from that.

And if you really wanna know a really really really painful HE halftrack try checking BK doc (maybe it's in the others too) 37mm halftrack. That thing is a moving 37 mm pak with permanent HE shots (so you don't even have to pay each time), with a really decent ROF and that vets up really fast too. It doesn't have arty salvo ability, but trust me, that thing kills infantry insanely good.

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Shanks
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 08 Oct 2017, 17:32

sgtToni95 wrote:I don't really think brits lack a good basic mortar, it's just not really suitable for your kind of indirect-fire harassing playstyle.

I know HE shots on autocar is really good now, just i don't think it's really that balance breaking. And RA doc is really ONLY arty more than a plan brit: no inf buffs, no fortification buffs, no big tanks, no resources excange. Just artillery units that basic brit doesn't have. Weaken its arty and the really few fancy units it has and this doctrine would suffer a lot imo.

Autocar scatter is really a lot based on RNG.. once you start seing shots landing you must be really unlucky or distracted to suffer a real pain from that.

And if you really wanna know a really really really painful HE halftrack try checking BK doc (maybe it's in the others too) 37mm halftrack. That thing is a moving 37 mm pak with permanent HE shots (so you don't even have to pay each time), with a really decent ROF and that vets up really fast too. It doesn't have arty salvo ability, but trust me, that thing kills infantry insanely good.



the basic troop of the British, is strong enough to destroy a jagdpanther, so what you tell me does not make much sense to me, the riflemen of the British, are able to confront the infantry of the luft also, perhaps do not have the comet in RA, but your basic troop is still very strong, I do not really understand what you mean sgtoni, when you tell me RA, "it's just arty", not even US infantry doctrine is just as efficient as RA, in regards to efficient anti-tank power, the infantry doctrine sends you a terror panther, and you can cause them many problems, because the M10 is obviously not as good as the M10 "Achilles", if you send a panther of terror to the British, you could lose it easily


@playbetter:you referred to what he wrote warhaks, and you gave him the reason, he was talking about axle camp game, I think I did not understand you so bad

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sgtToni95
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby sgtToni95 » 08 Oct 2017, 17:47

I said that RA is only arty more than plan brits, i didn't say RA is only arty. I'm perfectly aware that basic CW units are very strong, never said otherwise. I'm saying.that if you look at any other doc, they can count on different specializations after choosing the doc (some more, some less). RA tech tree is just arty, plus achilles and firefly which i guess you consider basic units. This is what i mean when i say that it's just arty MORE THAN PLAN BRITS.

Even a shreck squad can be enough to destroy a SP, and there could be many examples of basic units killing elite ones, so i don't see the point of saying "basic CW units can destroy a jadgpanther".

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Shanks
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Re: M3/T12 "Autocar".Doc RA

Postby Shanks » 08 Oct 2017, 21:38

Maybe, the translator from google, translates it wrong, but for me you still say the same lol


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